Senegal draws blood and leaves scars

[Estabannbella]

I'm new to this forum but have been reading a bunch on here. I'm struggling with a male Senegal that bites so hard it draws blood.

Here's a quick rundown on my situation. I got Esteban 6 years ago when he was just a few months weaned. He was an absolute love bug. Would climb around on me for hours throughout the day. Fly to me on command and would amaze people when he would fly through the house making left and right turns to find me anywhere I was. A couple of years later my company offered me a great position in Singapore with an unspecified timeframe of how long I would be gone. So Esteban went to go live with my parents for the next 3 years. They took great care of him, lots of toys, variety of healthy foods and clean safe environment. The downside was that they didn't handle him at all mostly out of fear of biting even though he was never a biter. He got plenty of outside cage time and had a tree stand for play.

On my return, he's just not the same happy, loving boy I used to have. He runs away from my hand when trying to have him step up. When he does step up he immediately sinks his beak into me as hard as he can and will not let go. I'm not a timid bird handler & I'd like to think of myself as pretty confident with birds. However no matter how patient, gentle or confident I am with him I get bit and bit hard. I have about eight experiences where I have had him step up, turn his head down for a neck scratch and then a vicious bite. I'll (as gently as I can) put him back on his cage and walk to the bathroom where my index finger or thumb are dripping blood. I once left him on my finger even after he bit me and blood was dripping, he then promptly bit my thumb. My girlfriend came home and screamed when she saw a pool of blood in the sink while I was patching myself up. I make it a point to go back to his cage afterwards and talk to him gently and calmly just so that he doesn't think that something bad happened. This last time he bit so hard he tore the flesh to the point I had to get stitches.

I have read every thing I can find on how to curb this behavior, tried every positive reinforcement technique I could find, sat outside his cage for hours trying to bond with him to no avail. Can someone please advise me on how to turn my boy back to how he was previously? I've been trying for nearly a year and it hasn't gotten any better (if not worse). Seems like the more I try, the more aggressive he gets and honestly I'm getting to the point where I've lost enough blood. Is there anything I can do? Or is he now a non-human contact bird?

[Weka]

Hi and welcome!

Ah, dear, I'm sorry to hear about your biting sennie. I'm sure some more experienced folk will chime in on your situation. I've been researching in case our future poicephalus turns out to be a biter (as he's been largely ignored for several years, as well) and one technique involves using a stick to re-train stepping up, by gradually shortening the length of the stick until the hand can be used. Have you heard of this? Also, what method did your parents use to get him to and from his cage?

Wishing you all the best,

Weka

[Estabannbella]

... one technique involves using a stick to re-train stepping up, by gradually shortening the length of the stick until the hand can be used. Have you heard of this? Also, what method did your parents use to get him to and from his cage? ...
Weka

Hi Weka - thanks for the welcome. I have tried the stick training method. I started with letting him touch the stick with his beak or foot and if he doesn't bite it I'll give him a pumpkin seed which is his treat of choice. I'll stop after each reward until he progressed to the point he was on the stick and would continue that exercise till he was comfortable on the stick. Here's where we had a few setbacks. Sometimes he would forego the treat and bite my fingers as I was attempting to treat him. Or he would get on the stick, move quickly down the stick and onto my hand. All good right? Nope, he would promptly bite my hand. I've tried to set him down before he gets to my hand, but the sudden movement of the stick freaks him out and he flies off into another area of the room. So guess what I do? I move to him slowly and let him climb on the stick - you guessed it - he quickly walks back to my hand and bites it.

My parents did not handle him at all. They would simply open the door to his cage and let him climb on to the tree right next to the cage. If they cleaned the cage they just rolled the cage away while he was on his tree. I still have hope since there are times when he will fly off his cage and over to me when I'm my couch and slowly climb on me. He'll often perch on my shoe fluff out and take a nap. So I get the sense he really wants to hang out with me, however, any movements to get him to step up and his eyes will pin, squawk, or fly off.

[Graeme]

I am not very experienced myself, but I can offer you some suggestions based on what I have read and researched.

When you are trying the stick method, you could place the end of a soft drink bottle at the end you hang onto. This would stop him biting and also running up the stick. To start keep the sessions really really short and positive.

I would not rush into it, take things VERY slow. Allow the bird to come to you and when he does, just talk to him without trying to make him do anything. You could try placing some treats close to him, but don't force him to take them.

With him freaking out when there are quick movements, I think it may just take time, a lot of time, for him to get used to things.

Hopefully someone with more experience can give you better information.

[Pajarita]

Has he been kept to a human light schedule instead of a bird light schedule? (meaning wake up with sunrise and eat dinner and go to bed with sunset -think of chickens and the birds out in the trees) Because it seems to me that he did not only loose his socialization but that he is also very hormonal. If he is on a human light schedule (artificial lights on when it's getting dark and after or before the sky is lit), switch him to a bird schedule right away. It won't help immediately because it will take time for his endocrine system to get back in tune with the seasons, plus, we just went through the winter solstice so the days are getting longer but it will help in time. Also, reduce his protein intake until the spring.

As to his biting, just open the cage door and walk away but don't leave the room. Spend time with him in the same room but don't ask him to step up, just talk/sing/offer treats and generally keep him company but don't ask for any type of physical interaction. Allow him to take the first step to start it, again. In the meantime, start target training him but, again, don't ask him to step up. He will come to you and, when he does, don't rush into a full blown relationship all at once, let him set the pace.

I've always said that male senegals are one of the most relentless aggressors there are... People talk about male amazons but the one bird that gave me the most grief was a male Senegal which had been kept in the same cage for 11 years and, when he came to me, he fell in love with my female Senegal and hated my guts with a passion because she loved me. That bird flew out to attack me several times a day, every single day for 3.5 years! I still have scars from his bites... they are absolutely relentless and fearless and, once they get hold of your flesh, would not let go! But he is fine now and has become a good friend who perches on my shoulder and comes for scritches daily (he is also one of my best talkers!).

[Wayne361]

I got a re-home male senegal and yep he was vicious at times. Now he is extremely well behaved and hasnt bit me for ages. Just read micheals taming/training tutorials and put in the time/effort. Positive reinforcement is key. Learn proper diet, and do lots of training for the sake of the birds health/mental well being, as well as creating the bond you are looking for. I would start from scratch if I were you. Avoid the bites by training in cage/targetting and work your way up. If he bites, go back a step or two and continue to work in situations where you cant be bit.

I would post links but not my forte. Just review his training blogs and the answers you are looking for are all there.

Wayne

[Estabannbella]

When you are trying the stick method, you could place the end of a soft drink bottle at the end you hang onto. This would stop him biting and also running up the stick.

Thanks Graeme - that's a great idea - I'll definitely try it. Slow and steady - I got it. I've been trying to be extremely patient. I've pulled up a chair next to his cage and watch TV/read books right next to him so he gets comfortable with me next to him.

Has he been kept to a human light schedule instead of a bird light schedule?

Thanks Pajarita - he's on a bad schedule. We wake up early, work all day and unfortunately usually get home at night - so most of our play time/out of cage time is after the sun sets. I know it's not the best, but if I kept him a spare bedroom so he could have a more natural light schedule, I wouldn't see him at all except for weekends!

In the meantime, start target training him but, again, don't ask him to step up. He will come to you and, when he does, don't rush into a full blown relationship all at once, let him set the pace.

I've been going slow. The boy isn't scared of me - not that I can tell. Like I mentioned earlier. He'll happily fly off his cage, come crawl on me and perch on my shoe when I've had my feet up on the couch. Him coming to me isn't the problem, it's when I try to move my hand close - big bite!

....once they get hold of your flesh, would not let go!

You hit it on the head! The guy locks on with his beak and clenches down. I think I have a pretty good pain tolerance because I try not to ever react, just move slowly back to the cage and let him hop off. But if I don't do that he'll just keep locked on even if there's blood dripping.

Just read micheals taming/training tutorials and put in the time/effort... I would start from scratch if I were you. Avoid the bites by training in cage/targetting and work your way up. If he bites, go back a step or two and continue to work in situations where you cant be bit.

Thanks Wayne. That's a good idea. I'll start from scratch and pretend we don't have any previous history at all. Oh - I'm ordering Michael's book. Hopefully that will help.

[Weka]

Do let us know how things are going in a few weeks. I'm reading Michaels' book right now, myself; perhaps we could start a thread where fellow readers can share what they've learned from it...

Best of luck in the New Year,

Weka

[Graeme]

I would also like to hear how you are both doing in a few weeks.

Best of luck