Biting Finger when stepping up?

[Calthesa]

Hi everyone.

So, our family has just gotten a red bellied parrot about four weeks ago and we were told he is around 4 months old. The bird seems to have adjusted to us, so we have been trying to cure his hand-shyness. We have made some good progress and he will now come take treats from our hands even with the other hand held nearby. He has never shown any inclination to bite before (mostly because he preferred to run away and we let him if it happened) so we are trying to teach him to step up with our bare hands since we don't have a small extra perch or anything around right now.

The only problem is, he is now bitting our fingers very hard whenever we let him get near it. Not because we are forcing him either, it's just that if we try to hold a treat out of reach and ask him to step up to reach it, he instead comes over and bites our fingers hard and incessantly. We don't think he's aggressive about it, it's more like he has either been taught to bite them before and does it automatically or is just bites really hard when he tests our finger as a perch instead of nibbling.

We have no idea what to do about this since we don't want to encourage it and we are all already becoming afraid of his beak and letting it near us. How do we teach him to be more gentle?

Thanks.

[Harpmaker]

Your bird is testing the perch to see if it is steady. When they are still young they don't know how hard a bite is a test vs how hard is aggression. You need to give the bird a verbal signal (I use "Be nice") to remind them not to overdo the pressure, and a verbal ("Good bird!") when they get it right. The first few times a treat may get their attention, but you don't want them to learn to bite you for a reward.

My Corsair no longer tests my fingers as perches, but she will grab one with her beak and try to put it on top of her head for scritches, even though that is anatomically impossible.

Also, most parrots seem to love having their beak scratched even through cage bars. That way both parties are protected. I remain wary of Amazon beaks, but with bars in between us, the 'zons can walk away instead of breaking my finger.

[Wolf]

Yep, Harpmaker has it right. You will have to teach him how hard is too much pressure and what is too much, I use gently or no bite.
The thing about baby parrots is that they do not know anything and so you have to teach them everything from how to eat and drink to everything else that you want them to know. They learned how to bite by learning to eat but have no idea as to how soft your skin is.

[Calthesa]

Ah, okay. That is reassuring. Thanks for the help!

[Pajarita]

Try wearing a tight fitting leather glove while you do it so it won't hurt so much while you teach him to be gentler.

[Harpmaker]

Good point Pajarita! Sometimes they are dissuaded by bandages all over your fingers, too. Corsair REALLY hates having her talons clipped or filed.

[Calthesa]

Great advice from Pajarita and Harpmaker! I think I'll try something like that. It's kind of hard to teach him "gentle" right now, since he keeps backing up.

[Pajarita]

If he backs up, you are pushing too hard. Birds should always be willing to step up and, if they show any reluctance whatsoever, you should NEVER insist. It's the kind of thing that backfires because they resent any type of force. Maybe that's why he is been rough with you. He has only been with you a few weeks and that's a VERY short time. Parrots have a completely different timetable than humans, what to us is a long time, it's a nanosecond to them.

My female Senegal comes with me to the canary room early in the am when I do the cleaning, feeding, etc. and she loves getting between the cages and pecking at the few seeds she can find there. And that's fine with me but, sometimes, she bothers the canaries because, when she sees them flying back and forth, she gets a bit overly excited and lunges at them. She can't do them any harm because they are inside the cage and she is outside (usually, on top of it) but they get scared so I have to remove her and, needless to say, she does NOT want to go so what I do is ask her to step up and, when she doesn't (and there is no 'if' about it, she never does it on the first request), I put my face in front of hers and talk to her in a sweet voice and say something like: "Awwww, Zoey girl, don't you want to come with your momma? Come with momma, Zoey girl. I love you! You are my sweet baby bird!" and gently touch her head and cheeks with the tip of my finger and make kissy noises, and, in no time at all, she puffs up (sign of contentment in senegals) and climbs on my finger. I then kiss her head, praise her and cuddle with her for a few seconds and all is well in our world.

Now, most people would say that it's ridiculous for an owner to beg an animal to follow a command, that owners should not have to cajole or talk their pet into complying, that the animal should either not do the 'wrong' thing or obey immediately when told not to do it but these people are thinking dogs and not parrots. Parrots are not hard-wired by nature to be obedient the way a dog is. In a flock, they are all equals and they all decide on their own what to do and what not to do so expecting a dog behavior from them is unrealistic. But, thankfully for us, parrots are very smart and very loving, and flattery and love will get you pretty much everything with them. But that implies respect for their wishes and decisions. We can try to convince them and make them change their minds but we should not expect them to and, if they do, recognize that they do it out of love for us, and be appreciative and thankful.

[Wolf]

I was going to say to you to be sure that you don't chase your bird when it backs away, but you already know that. So on to bigger and better things. I think that the best thing for your circumstances at this time is covered in this thread, viewtopic.php?f=11&t=227 , I could cover it for you myself but this is just as good and easier on me. I know that you will find the information very useful.

[Calthesa]

Thanks for all the help. I'm already reading through the thread Wolf gave me. Just to clarify though, when I say that he backs up, I don't mean that I'm chasing him, it's just that when I hold my finger out to touch his beak while he's biting too hard, he starts backing up and I can't do it. I try not to ever chase him or force him to do anything. Should I be avoiding getting too close at all?