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Overcoming Aggression/Basic Taming

Discuss the methods and techniques of clicker training, target training and bonding. These are usually the first steps in training a young parrot.

Re: Overcoming Aggression/Basic Taming

Postby Wolf » Fri May 20, 2016 8:13 am

Again my mind is running rampant and won't let me move away from this. I really don't know if anything that I will say will be helpful for you given your circumstances, but nothing ventured, nothing gained.

I am first of all basically a night person, who has always preferred to sleep during the day, I am also normally a very light sleeper and in addition to that I only sleep a couple of hours at a time.

Since my preferred sleeping time is during the day, natural sunlight does not interfere with me sleeping, so if that is true for you, then moving his cage to your room while you are sleeping would place him where he can see you and may eliminate his screaming for you while you sleep and still allow him to get normal exposure to natural lighting especially the crucial twilight periods that so greatly affect their hormones and mating drive. If that will work for you it will solve many of his problems in the long run.

This would then leave it to figure out how to give him the out of cage time as well as the one on one time that he is craving. This could be broken into two time periods once before you leave for work and once before you go to bed. Sometimes more times out even for shorter periods of time can be more beneficial for the bird than a longer one time deal on a daily basis. You could still take him to your friend place like you are currently doing. All of this combined would allow your bird to live a much more bird friendly lifestyle, which is much healthier for him. It could make the use of drugs unnecessary as he would be receive an better light schedule and still allow you to get the sleep that you need as well as probably more interaction time with you as well.

Think about it, try these suggestions and see if they help you and your bird. I think that these change would be beneficial for both of you. Let me know what you think or how it goes if you try them.
Wolf
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Re: Overcoming Aggression/Basic Taming

Postby ceruleansilver » Sat May 21, 2016 8:45 pm

I am the opposite, I already have a terrible time getting enough sleep. He is in my room, with the lights off during the day, when I sleep. I cannot turn the lights on during the day, or have the window open for him during the day or else I will not be able to sleep. If he is awake, he will scream until I am awake whether he can see me or not. There's really no way around this. He wants me to be awake and interacting with him. If I try and sleep in for an hour while he is awake he screeches non stop even when I am four feet away from him. I find it pointless to try and set an alarm to wake up for this very reason, I already have an obnoxious fuzzy alarm clock.

The test results came back. He has no kind of liver function problem or issue of any kind on the cbc/chem bile acids and nova. We'll be moving forward with the lupron injections, as I can't see any other solution for this constant breeding mode and resulting suffering brought up on this thread. His needs directly contradict my needs, heck, really this schedule is contrary for both of us. I understand drugs are not ideal, but I think surrendering would be even less ideal. The vet also recommended, ironically, a less nutritious diet. Has anyone on here had any success with this to curb breeding season urges or any suggestions? I think she was mostly referring to things like scrambled eggs, nuts, and other high caloric items. He's definitely not "lean", but he's not obese either. I always feel a little uncomfortable trying to help a bird lose weight, because I know it can go south very quickly without close monitoring.

I already practice other methods to discourage undesirable behavior. I don't touch anywhere but his head except to examine a broken feather, and also I'm trying to train him to flip onto his back. I don't have any areas in his cage that are private, I don't let him nest under pillows or in crevices, and if he starts doing a "skirt dance" I put him back up on his cage (although this does get me bit pretty regularly).
ceruleansilver
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Re: Overcoming Aggression/Basic Taming

Postby Wolf » Sun May 22, 2016 8:04 am

Yes, I am sure that he is speaking of reducing both the level of protein and fat in the birds diet and possibly reducing carbs as well, which is most often done by increasing the level of fiber. This is hard to do if you are relying on commercially prepared feeds. This is one of the reasons that I feed my birds gloop as I can change what I make it from to reduce the protein level or increase the amount of fiber or whatever is required for my bird's well being. And that is why I spend a lot of time reading the ingredients on the seed mixes that I use so that I can get seeds that are not as high in fats and that does not have all kinds of additives in it.
Wolf
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 8679
Location: Lansing, NC
Number of Birds Owned: 6
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal
African Grey (CAG)
Yellow Naped Amazon
2Celestial Parrotlet
Budgie
Flight: Yes

Re: Overcoming Aggression/Basic Taming

Postby Pajarita » Tue May 24, 2016 11:55 am

Wolf is correct. High protein, high fat, high carbs do contribute to breeding condition. Please do research on Lupron before you make up your mind. Vets are very quick to suggest it because, in truth, it's the only thing they have in their arsenal as the only effective remedy is husbandry (diet, light schedule, etc), something that they cannot control but Lupron is very iffy when it comes to birds (it was made for dogs). For one thing, it doesn't work on every single species or even individual bird, for another, the exact dosages are not known (remember it was made for mammals) and, last but not least, it cannot be used long term. This is because what Lupron does is make the body increase sexual hormone production to levels so high that the body, realizing there is something VERY wrong, shuts down production altogether. So, in reality, it's not as if Lupron was 'fixing' the problem with the endocrine system, it merely screws it up even more.

Now, please don't take what I am going to say the wrong way. I am not suggesting you do it or not do it, I am merely giving you my opinion -and mostly because this is a personal beef of mine. People usually talk of rehoming as if it implied some kind of failure on the parrot keeper's side or a terrible thing to do to the bird but, in reality, is doesn't have to be. Depending on the circumstances, it could very well be the best thing you can do for a bird and the ultimate test of love. I am actually looking for a home for one of my birds. I give them all love and very good care (fresh, organic diet, strict solar schedule, full spectrum lights, cage-free life, natural perches, etc) but she doesn't have anybody of her own and she wants a man - which I am not. She doesn't bite me or anything but she loves my husband who is not a parrot person and doesn't spend any amount of time with her... so she is suffering from a lack that I cannot fulfill -thus, because I love her and want the best for her, I am looking for a better home than the one I can provide.
Pajarita
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Re: Overcoming Aggression/Basic Taming

Postby ceruleansilver » Thu May 26, 2016 5:06 am

I appreciate where you're coming from, and it's not off the table. If the Lupron doesn't help him, then I absolutely will rehome him. The vet has even offers to put out feelers if it doesn't work. He got his first injection today, he's already stopped self mutilating just from the behavioral side alone, and more and more people are getting comfortable petting him. That being said, today was another bad day in the context of his improvement, where he bit several people fairly seriously, myself included. I'm not expecting miracles from this drug, just a more predictable even keeled companion.

I want to say his unpredictable behavior is hormonal. I can't trust this bird, and that's a major roadblock. I know it's from husbandry, but as I've already laid out I cannot change that. The vet explained very clearly to me what Lupron does, and we're cautiously optimistic. I understand it was not made for birds, but I see rehoming as the last option, and this is the option before that. I should get results in the next two weeks if I'm going to get any, and go off of that. As far as I'm aware the vet said he can stay on lupron indefinitely, just capture the cycle and then see how long after the initial three shots it takes to wear off, rinse and repeat as needed (so basically biannually for a spring/fall breeding season bird). And it's not permanent, as I don't see myself being an overnight we for more then a couple years.

So, that's the game plan. If it goes horribly the first round only lasts two weeks, so I'll have a heading for where this is all going pretty quickly here. Thank you for telling me your own story about your bird, I definitely think you're doing the right thing, I'm just not quite there yet.
ceruleansilver
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