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Need some help! Double yellow amazon

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Need some help! Double yellow amazon

Postby Wonderbar2121 » Mon Oct 01, 2018 3:08 pm

This is a bit I a long one. So my spouse decided to get a fledging double yellow a few years back. Before we were a couple. I already know about the bird and his bond and all that. That’s not what concerns me. Not exactly. I’ve read all about the aggression they can show but this one seems over the top. I understand her wanting to attack me and even our other conure. It’s an intrusion. But the problem lies with the aggression over all. Everything I’ve read, people say it’s around when they hit sexual maturity and only when hormonal. Well she isn’t old enough to hit sexual maturity yet. And is aggressive 24/7. I mean if you let her land, when she swoops, which is also constant when you’re in the room, she will try to gauge you. She actually tries to hurt. And not just me or our infant. She attacks him as well. That was right from the start. He knew it would take some time for her to get used to him and it was a good few months before they were bonded. But even with that bond, she still attacks him. Actual hard bites. It doesn’t matter the repercussion or how long she is caged and covered for. He can handle her very well and often but its only maybe five to ten minutes before she bites him and hard. He can’t have her on his shoulder without almost instant biting of the face of ears. I can’t be anywhere near him without her swooping trying to attack my face. We can’t have our baby in the same room for the same reason. We can’t eat supper without her swooping is. When he leaves for work in the morning, she will swoop the door. And it’s all with intention of hurting. Not bluff charges. They are intentional. Talons our ready to land and scratch. And of course screaming. You can’t use the bathroom ten feet away without her screaming. And there are levels of screams. Anyone with a bird knows that. They start out with normal screeches and go into aggressive sounding, throat hurting screams. Within moments. Nothing has worked. More attention, less attention. Bigger cage, more freedom, being clipped, not being clipped(has made it worse so that’s probably going away soon), socializing, covering, food change, we’ve bought more lamps with those super bright heating bulbs, bring her upstairs to our room, he will spend one on one time, treats, more toys. If there is anything we haven’t tried, please tell me. He’s actually talking about getting rid of her if the behaviour doesn’t change. It’s not safe for anyone in the house or visiting. I believe she’s just four now. But she’s been this way since the day he’s adopted her. IS there any fixing this?
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 1
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Pineapple conure
Double Yellow Headed Amazon
Flight: Yes

Re: Need some help! Double yellow amazon

Postby Pajarita » Wed Oct 03, 2018 11:11 am

Welcome to the forum and I am sooooo sorry you are going through this very difficult situation with your bird! Now, before I say anything else, let me answer your question: Yes, it can be fixed - without a single doubt in my mind, I can guarantee you it can because I've done it [I have four zons right now but have had more in the past] and anything I do, anybody else can do, too. It's just a matter of understanding exactly what is going on.

I will go into the 'whys' of the behavior but, before I do that, I am a bit confused because you talk about getting the bird 'a few years back' but then say the bird is not sexually mature yet and this doesn't quite add up because zons are sexually mature by the time they are two years old so, if she [do you know for a fact, this is a 'she' because 'she' sounds like a 'he' to me] has been with you for 'a few years', the bird is sexually mature. Another thing you need to take into consideration when it comes to sexual maturity and hormone production is diet and light schedule. A bird that is free-fed pellets made with soy will mature earlier and will become overly hormonal easier - and, a bird that is kept at a human light schedule instead of a bird light schedule and free-fed protein food [pellets, seeds, nuts, nutriberries, avicakes, etc] will become overly hormonal in a few years, too. So, the first order of business is to make sure that the bird is getting the right diet [low protein, low fat, high moisture, high fiber, no soy, no animal protein at all] and the right light schedule [a strict solar one with full exposure to dawn and dusk].

The thing about keeping birds as pets is that they cannot adjust to a human lifestyle so we need to adjust our lifestyle to their needs [both physical and emotional]. Birds are photoperiodic which means that they 'mark' their life 'periods' [aka seasons, as breeding -spring and summer, molting -end of summer, resting -no sexual hormone production in the winter, etc] by the amount of light [photo from the greek word] they are exposed to AND what tells their body when the day starts and when it ends [the number of hours in between these two daily events being what tells them what season it is] is the different light spectrum that only happens during twilight [dawn and dusk]. Think of it as a stop watch, it starts running when the bird is exposed to the light of dawn and it stops when it's exposed to the light of dusk. When you expose a bird to artificial light before the sun is up in the sky and after it is halfway down to the horizon, you are artificially creating eternal breeding season. This added to a diet too rich in protein makes them overly hormonal. Because there is a huge difference between a bird that is normally hormonal [which happens every year during the natural breeding season of the species] and a bird that is overly hormonal which means that the poor thing has been producing sexual hormones way after it should have stopped. Birds have sexual organs that are only supposed to be active during breeding season and, as soon as the season ends, the organs stop producing hormones and go dormant, shrinking to teeny tiny BUT when a bird continues producing them, season after season, year after year, they end up with HUGE organs that end up displacing other internal organs creating best case scenario discomfort and worst case scenario chronic pain. This pain is worse for males than it is for females and it brings super aggression in male amazons [that's why I wonder if your bird is, indeed, a female].

Some species are worse than others and we have 'split' them into what we call hormonal species and non-hormonal species. Macaws are non-hormonal but all zons are hormonal and, within all the zon species, there are three that are worse and called the 'hot three' and the DYAs are one of the 'hot three'. BUT the problem is not the species or even the gender so much but the actual husbandry because I have three wild-caught females and one captive-bred male which was terribly aggressive when he first came because he was not only overly hormonal due to a bad diet and light schedule but also because he had been abused by his previous owner [he admitted to punching the bird] and he is now fine so, as you can see, it can be done.

This is what I would do:
1. make sure it's getting the right diet: you can NOT free-feed any protein food [it makes the bird very aggressive and it destroys its liver and kidneys], it needs to be a measured amount [mine get two level tablespoons of a cockatiel seed mix and three 'peanuts' [my birds think that all nuts are peanuts :D but they would get, for example, - one almond, one half of a pecan and one pistachio], and it needs to get a lot of raw produce as well as cooked grains and veggies [mine get gloop and raw produce for breakfast and all day picking with the seed/nut mix for dinner]. Absolutely no animal protein, no meat, no eggs, no cheese, no nothing from an animal's body [they are herbivores, not omnivores as some people say].
2. make sure it's kept under a strict solar schedule with two hours of exposure to dawn and another two hours to dusk [this is essential and there is no way that you can reproduce dawn and dusk with artificial lights so you need to follow the sun].
3. I would NOT clip. It only makes things worse as time goes by because a] the only way a bird has of dissipating 'bad' [sex and stress] hormones is through flight [nature never counted on us, humans, thinking that we know better than her so she did not give them any other form of exercise] so, when you clip, all you are doing is concentrating the hormones instead of getting rid of them. b] a grounded bird is more prone to breeding behavior as the only time in the wild that they kind of like 'stay put' is when they are breeding. c] flight is a distraction and you want the bird to be as 'distracted' as possible [baths are good, too]. d] a bird that has been fully flighted will resent [and blame the humans] for the grounding, making things worse in terms of 'mood'.
4. I would not allow my child to handle an amazon. I don't allow anybody to handle mine - not even my husband [well, let me clarify this, my husband handles the parrot that chose him over me and can help cleaning, feeding, giving praise and treats, even putting them back in their cages when it's 'time' but this is done with a stick, never to his hand or shoulder]. The thing is that parrots are not and never will be family pets. It's not in their nature... they simply did not evolve this way. They can have a flock-mate relationship with everybody in the family but they belong to one person and one person only: their chosen human. And this chosen human is hardly ever a child for the simple reason that even adults have a heap of trouble learning a parrot's body language and understanding how different they are from, say, dogs - and children are hardly ever equanimous and even-tempered - an essential quality for all correct parrot handling.
Norwegian Blue
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 15786
Location: NE New Jersey
Number of Birds Owned: 30
Types of Birds Owned: Toos, grays, zons, canaries, finches, cardinals, senegals, jardine, redbelly, sun conure, button quail, GCC, PFC, lovebirds
Flight: Yes

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