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Senegal-Kiwi

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Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Cinski » Mon Jan 18, 2010 9:58 am

Good morning,
I need some advice. Yesterday I brought home a 2 year old orange breasted Senegal named Kiwi. This is my first bird. My husband has had an African Grey for 10 years and his family has had birds for quite a while. He is very comfortable and confident with birds. I am not. When we saw Kiwi she was very sweet to both of us even though the woman at the pet shop said she was aggressive and bit a lot. Kiwi let both of us hold her and only bit my husband once because I moved too quickly and frightened her. She has been very sweet since we got her.

Kiwi isn't the problem. I am. I love birds but I have a fear of being bit that I'm having trouble overcoming. My husbands mother had a cocatoo that I was told was very nice. Loved to cuddle, very much like a baby. One day she flew off her perch to me and didn't get a good grip of my hand and bit me to keep from falling. It was my first bird bite and at the time I didn't understand that she was trying not to fall. It seemed like an attack to me at the time. It was painful and took a while to heal. Ever since then I've kept my distance because I don't understand the body language. On a different occasion my husband's African Grey bit me on a day when he was being really nice and accepting of my presence. My husband told me to scratch his head but I was bit due to my nervousness.

When I got Kiwi I was very brave and due to the reasearch I had done on her species I felt comfortable with her. Once we got home that fear came back. My husband has told me not to flinch if she nips at me but I find that to be hard. He's told me that I just need to let her bite me once to see it's not so bad and then I won't fear it anymore. I love this bird and I want to be able to take her from her cage and pet her while I hold her. My husband can hold her and do tricks with her and pet her and even kiss her beak but I just hold her and try to be as calm as I can. The only time I feel completely confident in getting her to step up is when she flies off her perch and she's on the floor. When she is in her cage she snaps at me every time and when she is on her perch and eye level with me it makes me nervous.

I don't know bird body language. I have no idea what I'm doing. I want to be good to my bird and have a great relationship with her but the problems are all mine. How can I overcome these issues? Do you have any tips that I can work on over time to help?

Thank you in advance.
Cinski
Parrotlet
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 13
Number of Birds Owned: 4
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, (other birds in household, African Grey, lovebird, cockatiel)
Flight: No

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Michael » Mon Jan 18, 2010 10:33 am

First off, you must act quickly or not let your husband handle the bird any more or you will never be able to handle her. Senegal Parrots are very loyal one person birds. Even if they are properly socialized, they gravitate more towards a favorite person. If your husband continues treating her well and you do nothing, you will be shut out from being able to handle the bird permanently. So I will try to give you some advice what to do, but you must do it and catch up or surpass your husband or it will become his bird.

Put yourself in the bird's shoes. There is this one human that doesn't touch you much, is shaky, feels like is going to drop you. Then there's this other human who is nice to you, holds you, pets you, takes care of you... see where I'm going. The bird has more reason to prefer your husband now and eventually that relationship will solidify. I know this because Kili doesn't like my girlfriend. She wasn't a big part of Kili's life earlier on and now it has been really hard to work her in retrospectively.

First off, you have to stop being scared of the bird. It just won't work if your scared. If you're scared, you're going to be eradic and unpredictable which will scare the bird. And what does a scared parrot do? Bite! In my experience 80% of people who thought they will get bit by my parrot did and 80% of people who didn't know she could bite didn't get bit. Sometimes someone would handle her not knowing she can bite and it would be fine, then I'd mention that you have to be careful because she can bite and then they would act incorrectly and a bite would result. So it is definitely important to forget about the bite and act confidently. Acting confidently does not mean being forceful or boisterous. Just means to not fear the bird. You also have to be rational. If the bird is sitting there playing with a toy, why would it want to be grabbed by you? Why wouldn't it bite? If the bird is eating and you ask it to step up, why should it? On the other hand, if the bird is sitting there not doing anything and bored, perhaps it will enjoy your company.

If you are still scared, then you should use tools so that you can avert pain and act more confidently. You'll also have to learn a bit about basic animal training. I've written about these topics extensively and you have to be willing to do some reading on your own if you want to find out more about this. If you have questions about the following topics as they relate specifically to your situation, just post those concerns back on this topic.

Teach parrot to step up without biting

Specific types of Senegal Parrot bites, reasons, and body language

Lots of other feedback from Senegal Parrot owners about biting

Collection of articles and experiences of Senegal Parrot owners

This should be a good start. Then if you have any specific questions, let us know.
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6286
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Cinski » Mon Jan 18, 2010 11:01 am

Michael,
Thank you very much for your advice. Alowing my husband to become Kiwi's main person is something that I told him I didn't want from the begining. Currently I am out of work so I am home all day with the birds. So I feel that this is a great opportunity for me to work on these issues I have. I want Kiwi to be mine and love me over everyone else. I want a good relationship with her. I've read a lot on this forum so far and I will read all that you have recommended.

You mentioned wearing a glove when getting her to step up and I think that would really help me, is there a certain type of glove that would work or should I just try it and see how she reacts to it?

Soon we will have a much larger cage for the African Grey and will probably move Kiwi to his old cage because it is a little bigger and designed more friendly get getting the bird in and out of the cage which is a problem that I am having with Kiwi's current cage(that came with her when I bought her). She is always percheded to the right of the door so I have to contort my hand to reach her to get her to step up. It might not be a problem to her but I feel like I'm cornering her so it only adds to my nerves. Instead of biting the bullet and trying I end up asking my husband to get her out for me which only makes it harder for me to do it I'm sure. Once she's out she'll step up to my hand from his and let me hold her and walk around with her and put her back in her cage. This morning she helped me make coffee. :)

I am also going to make sure I get some information(in may be in the links you provided) on body language. I read somewhere on this site that when they get puffed up it's a good thing but I had always thought it was the equivelant to a dog raising it's fur out of aggression. I learn something new every day!

Again thank you for your help! I really do appreciate it!
Cinski
Parrotlet
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 13
Number of Birds Owned: 4
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, (other birds in household, African Grey, lovebird, cockatiel)
Flight: No

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Michael » Mon Jan 18, 2010 11:44 am

It depends. Usually the reason they puff up is to keep warm and they need to keep warm more when they are relaxed. It's like you need a blanket when you sleep but fine walking around in a shirt midday.

I would say that if you want to get things going with that Senegal, you should stop all of your husband's interaction with the bird (especially getting it out for you) until you are fully comfortable with it and bonded. Then you can start reintroducing him. You see, he has the advantage already and will probably be just as capable of getting along with it when you reach a comfort level. However, if he continues to interact, the bird will quickly prefer him because he knows what he is doing.

You want to get the thinnest possible leather gloves. The cheapest/easiest way to do it is to go to a hardware store and get carpenter's gloves like these:

Image

You want to feel the bird and be in control. You want the birds feet to be able to grasp your finger through the glove. So you do not want a thick glove. The glove is only to prevent breaking of the skin if it bites and to make you feel more confident. Once you get used to each other you wont need it any more. The bite will barely hurt or not at all through a glove. Thick gloves will make it uncomfortable and you will lose any handle/feel. I'll try to get a shot of the glove my girlfriend uses later. BTW only use one glove so that you are free to manipulate things with your other hand like feeding treats or holding a target stick. Obviously use the glove for the hand the bird perches on.
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6286
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Cinski » Mon Jan 18, 2010 12:06 pm

I have a glove like the one you mentioned. I gave it a shot. You were right, it really helped my confidence. She wasn't eating or playing, just sitting there. She seemed really interested in me so I opened the door and tried to get her to step up with the glove and crunch! Big whoppin' bite! Good thing I had on the glove. I tried again but I could tell she was afraid so after another attempt I withdrew. Now she growls and snaps at me when I get anywhere near her cage.

This is going to take some time.
Cinski
Parrotlet
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 13
Number of Birds Owned: 4
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, (other birds in household, African Grey, lovebird, cockatiel)
Flight: No

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Michael » Mon Jan 18, 2010 12:24 pm

A) Parrot may be scared of glove. You can check if it is you or the glove by having your husband wear glove and have her step up. If the parrot is scared of glove, it may only induce unnecessary biting.

B) Don't just jump right into going for the bird with glove. Use target training and positive reinforcement to coax the bird to come to you rather than to chase it with your gloved hand.

Don't do anything wearing the glove you wouldn't do with your bare hand. Just use it as insurance so it doesn't hurt too much if it bites. Just remember that every time you get bitten wearing the glove, that you would have gotten that if you weren't. However, if the parrot does bite, you must ignore the bite and show it that it does not hurt you. You must not react or it encourages biting. It must learn that biting does nothing to you. However, you must teach it alternative behaviors that it can do to signal to you that it wants something. Teach the parrot a trick or vocalization so if it wants food it will do the trick rather than bite. If you see that the parrot wants to come out of cage, take it out. If you see that parrot wants to go back to cage, put it back. Learn to do what it wants before the bite happens but ignore the bites if they do happen. Don't rush the process. Make sure that you are doing this at your and the parrot's pace.
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6286
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Cinski » Tue Jan 19, 2010 8:34 am

Yesterday got better.

When my husband came home from work yesterday the first thing he did was get Kiwi out of her cage and hand her off to me. I held her until dinner was ready then we put her up. When I finished eating she was already handed off to me again. The whole time holding her my husband was observing and giving me little tips and pep talks. This time holding her she felt a lot more comfortable on my finger. Until last night she would wobble a little and seem unsure.

Kiwi doesn't like for me to pet her when I'm holding her. It probably has to do with the nerves, My husband does and she's fine with it. But that's something that Kiwi and I are going to have to work on. I have a plan now and with my husbands help I think it'll work if I can be patient. Basically, I hold her as much as possible and gradually, as I get more comfortable, work in the petting.

Last night Kiwi and I made a new game and I taught her a new word! I'm not sure what it's called when you have your bird perched on your finger and you drop your hand and they flap their wings? Well, she LOVED that game and I would ask her each time if she was ready...."Ready Kiwi?" We played over and over and then my husband and I started talking and I got distracted and next thing I knew my little Kiwi was saying very clearly, "READY!?" and holding her wings out like she was preparing for it. I laughed so hard and then she got to where she would say "ready? and chuckle a little. It was so awesome! I love teaching animals new things, I haven't been this excited since the time I taught my sister's cat to sit for pouncer treats! We had a ball! I held her and we played for such a long time. She even let me flip her upsidedown a few times!

Then I got courageous and tried to scratch her head. She gave all the signs she gives anyone else when she wants a scratch but for me it was a fake out. She latched onto my finger and bit down HARD. Not once but 3 times in succession. haha! It hurt so bad that I couldn't help but say "OW!" but I didnt' flinch or jerk my hand (Mostly cause she was perched on it and I knew it would make it worse). Instead I calmly walked her to her cage and told her it was time for bed and we would play again when she's going to be nice.

So we got some really great quality time and I got the poop bit out of me! And guess what? It hurt like crazy but it wasn't as bad as I expected it. I'm surprised but getting bit actually made me a little braver.

We'll get there!
Cinski
Parrotlet
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 13
Number of Birds Owned: 4
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, (other birds in household, African Grey, lovebird, cockatiel)
Flight: No

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Michael » Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:09 am

Make sure you know how to pet your parrot and that you're not doing it unless it wants it. Petting a parrot in the wrong place or at the wrong time will piss them off and it will probably bite. Never force petting onto it but let it come to you for it or offer it and see the reaction.

Not that Kili bites me but she can sometimes get nippy if I'm petting her like *nibble finger "over here dummy!" So what I do actually is hold her beak while I pet her and then she can't be annoying and nibble. Watch this video and you can see how much she likes it.



Also the thing that got me to a real comfort level when I first got Kili was to touch her beak. Senegals like getting their beak scratched. And if your finger is on the parrot's beak, that is the one place it cannot bite you! I used to just rest my finger on her maxilla and scratch around. She liked it and didn't bite. Similarly if I'm petting her, I might rest my finger on there for leverage and protection. Often if I let someone else pet Kili I will hold her beak shut so she can't sneak a bite in.
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6286
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Cinski » Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:16 am

I'll try those things. I'm still trying to learn her body language. I've noticed that she never seems to want me to scratch her head, once in a while she'll let me do it through the bars in her cage. My husband on the other hand can reach out and touch her any time he wants with no regard for what she wants and nothing happens. Maybe she's already fallen for him, I don't know.

She likes to fake me out. Yesterday she acted like she really wanted a scratch and she bit me. This morning I had a few cups of coffee and then went to see what kind of mood Kiwi was in (because she's not a morning birdy) and she was happy. I scratched her through the cage and then opened the door to give her some food and she acted like she wanted to step up. I was wrong and she bit me. I'm still working on the nerves but I'm not letting it get in my way anymore and I didn't feel the slightest nervous or afraid. I know it's silly of me but it kinda pissed me off that she tricked me....again.

It could be that she is happy in her cage. My husband got a large cage from his mother that used to house her macaw(unfortunately the macaw and her cockatoo died due to smoke inhalation during a fire). He had it sandblasted and powder coated and we just got it back yesterday. Once we assembled it we put it in the livingroom where Kiwi is and now Ceasar the african grey lives in there instead of the kitchen. So all of the birds are in the same room. Right now they are all talking and chattering. So it could be that she's just happy where she is. I don't really know.

I do incorporate your advise when I'm handling her. I try something new everyday and see how she reacts to it. I have gotten more patient though. I've only had her a few days but each day does seem to get a little better, a little more trust.
Cinski
Parrotlet
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 13
Number of Birds Owned: 4
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, (other birds in household, African Grey, lovebird, cockatiel)
Flight: No

Re: Senegal-Kiwi

Postby Michael » Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:36 am

You may not want to do these cage upgrades you were talking about. The thing is that a macaw cage is unsuitable for a grey and a grey cage is not suitable for a Senegal. And this is not because of the size of the cage. Sure it's great for them to have a bigger cage. But the issue is the bar spacing. Macaw cages usually space the bar at over an inch and a half. A grey cage is normally 3/4 to 1 inch spacing. And a Senegal Cage is about 1/2 or 5/8. I've seen a video of a Senegal Parrot in an African Grey cage sticking its head between the bars. A bird in a cage where the bar spacing is too big may not be able to get out but it could get its head caught. Beware, never put a parrot in a cage where its head fits between the bars.
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6286
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

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