I decided!!! No more waiting! I am getting a Handfed sennie!

[Nir]

ALRIGHT ALREADY! IM starting to get cross eyed reading this.If this doesnt work out [I can give him a good home] I live in New York.

damn you do? in nyc ? How big is your place and are your birds flighted?

[marie83]

Nir, I'm going to stay out of the room size issue because I haven't got a clue but I do believe birds are meant to fly and it is cruelty to keep one in a situation where it cannot fly well or at all because of a lack of space or through clipping.

What I wanted to say is that if you dont believe in clipping then please please find a breeder who does not clip, babies need to fledge properly and breeders will only stop clipping their babies if the demand for clipped birds drop. If people want flighted birds, that is what the breeders will sell.
I think its a responsibility to stand up for what you belive in, you wouldn't believe in god and then worship the devil.

[Nir]

Nir, I'm going to stay out of the room size issue because I haven't got a clue but I do believe birds are meant to fly and it is cruelty to keep one in a situation where it cannot fly well or at all because of a lack of space or through clipping.

What I wanted to say is that if you dont believe in clipping then please please find a breeder who does not clip, babies need to fledge properly and breeders will only stop clipping their babies if the demand for clipped birds drop. If people want flighted birds, that is what the breeders will sell.
I think its a responsibility to stand up for what you belive in, you wouldn't believe in god and then worship the devil.

well i dont believe in clipping but from the breeders point of view where they are probably responsible for dozens and dozens of birds, i can see how having 50 flighted birds might not be the safest thing to do therefore they clip to manage the birds better. I think my place is big enough for my sennie to stay flighted and be happy. Might not be idle but with my ceiling being as high as it is (over 20 feet) i think its not as bad as it sounds. but again i will reevaluate once his wings grows back.

[terri]

Nir,I live in upstate New york [but am serious about what I said] I own my own home that is good size.I am not real experienced in this free flight thing.But I didnt learn till this forum how important not clipping there wings are[most of mine were clipped].So now as there wings are growing back they are flying around.I have not spent much time training them on this [except my lory].Some are better navigators than others,but I havent had any problems or injurys.I just have to keep an eye on them landing on someone elses cage One more thing {And I wouldnt suggest this unless I believed in it] Im a very well thought out person. caiques ,caiques did I say caiques? You dont see too many of them in rescues HMM[I wonder why ] I think there great, had them long enough to go through the stages so I can tell you.I feel fortunate that I picked Greta she was my first bird and I didnt know a thing about her.I was deathly afraid of parrots and liked her size and temperment.If you get advice about caiques get them from competent caring owners not breeders
or desciptions from articles.

[Eurycerus]

Are you joking? You're planning on supposing a breeder farm and not an ethical breeder and trying to rationalize why that's acceptable? I find that very wishy washy and not acceptable.

[Nir]

Are you joking? You're planning on supposing a breeder farm and not an ethical breeder and trying to rationalize why that's acceptable? I find that very wishy washy and not acceptable.

not sure what your talking about? When did i support unethical breeders. Actually how would i even differentiate ethical from unethical. Didn't you buy a bird? Doesn't that mean your supporting the over populated issue we have? Explain your reasoning please. If you are referring to me saying "50 birds" obviously i was exagerating a bit. I dont know anything about breeding or breeders but i was just seeing it from their point of view. Can you name me a breeder that does not clip any birds (even without request). I wouldnt mind buying from them instead.

[Nir]

caiques from what i know are not apartment birds. They are too loud i think.

[Eurycerus]

No i adopted, she's six, and there are breeders that don't clip. Pretty sure Michael got his from one such breeder. Do your research! I am skeptical that you are phoning and really asking around., there are six Senegals alone in the area i live in that are up for adoption.

Ethical are breeders that keep the parrots welfare forefront and money after. Parent raised parrots that aren't clipped. Even then i don't believe in breeding because there are so many unwanted parrots and you should not be supporting such an industry. However at least an ethical breeder is the least of all evils and some parrots are impossible to find for adoption. regardless i don't think you are trying enough to find a Senegal for adoption....

Use the internet! Be patient. You've waited this long.

Also yeah I've heard caiques are too loud

[Nir]

No i adopted, she's six, and there are breeders that don't clip. Pretty sure Michael got his from one such breeder. Do your research! I am skeptical that you are phoning and really asking around., there are six Senegals alone in the area i live in that are up for adoption.

Ethical are breeders that keep the parrots welfare forefront and money after. Parent raised parrots that are clipped. Even then i don't believe in breeding because there are so many unwanted parrots and you should not be supporting such an industry. However at least an ethical breeder is the least of all evils and some parrots are impossible to find for adoption. regardless i don't think you are trying enough to find a Senegal for adoption....

Use the internet! Be patient. You've waited this long.

Also yeah I've heard caiques are too loud

michael got kili from a bird store which clips so does that make him unethical? He requested truman not be clipped from african queen but i am willing to bet that if its not requested, that breeder also by norm clips but i might be wrong. but even if i am wrong, find me some breeders that ethically never clips and i will buy from them even if i have to drive 5+ hours. . are you saying that anyone who doesn't get a rehome is unethical?

go ahead and use craigs list. I dont live in texas . Find me a rescue near nyc. You need to do your research before you start accusing.

also your right. I am actually leaning more for a baby now then a rehome to be honest. The rehome i wanted i got rejected for lol . but i would still be open to going to a rescue if there was any within couple hours away but there isnt.

[Eurycerus]

michael got kili from a bird store which clips so does that make him unethical? He requested truman not be clipped from african queen but i am willing to bet that if its not requested, that breeder also by norm clips but i might be wrong. but even if i am wrong, find me some breeders that ethically never clips and i will buy from them even if i have to drive 5+ hours. . are you saying that anyone who doesn't get a rehome is unethical?

go ahead and use craigs list. I dont live in texas . Find me a rescue near nyc. You need to do your research before you start accusing.

also your right. I am actually leaning more for a baby now then a rehome to be honest. The rehome i wanted i got rejected for lol . but i would still be open to going to a rescue if there was any within couple hours away but there isnt.

in some regards yes i think it's not ethical to support a breeder of any kind (including dogs, cats, etc, so this actually isn't parrot specific. There are so many unwanted animals!!!). I think it's fine that people do it because I'm not in charge of their life, but if you preach that you don't believe in something you should abide by it. I'm not sure much about the breeder world because I pretty much didn't do any research on that front. There are rescues. It takes about two months to become eligible. Most rescues require a home visit and phone interview, minimum. Don't be surprised. You need to watch craigslist every day if you are really serious. Senegals pop up very often. I'm from California not Texas?? but New York I'm sure is very similar. It takes patience and caring.

Here's a Senegal from a parrot rescue: http://www.liparrotsociety.org/Parrot%2 ... arrots.htm

I did a quick search and found a list of these rescues. Not sure how up to date the list is but worth an email to these people. You can ask them what the news is on nearby rescues too even if they aren't around anymore:
Central New York Avian Rescue. Rescue and adoption, 501(c)(3) nonprofit, 103 East 8th St., Oswego 13126. Therese McAdams, lotwilight@hotmail.com or hokusrick@msn.com

Chipper Chirpers Adoption Link, Inc. Rescue and adoption; no adoption fee; 501(c)(3) nonprofit, P.O. Box 95, East Concord, 14055; (716) 592-9254, birrdladdy@aol.com

HomeTweetHome. Rescue and adoption, upstate New York; hometweet@aol.com

Long Island Parrot Society. Adoption referral only, adoption fee; North Babylon; (631) 957-1100, lipsgeneral@liparrotsociety.org

Love My Parrots, Avian Rescue, Rehab & Sanctuary. Central Square; lovemyparrots@twcny.rr.com

The Priceless Parrot Preserve, Inc. Rescue and adoption, 501(c)(3) nonprofit, P. O. Box 691, Ridge 11967; (613) 924-8725; Gene and Marietta Avery, pricelesparrot@aol.com

Second Chance Bird Rescue. Rescue and adoption, 501(c)(3) nonprofit, Rochester.

also your right. I am actually leaning more for a baby now then a rehome to be honest. The rehome i wanted i got rejected for lol . but i would still be open to going to a rescue if there was any within couple hours away but there isnt.

That's great!