Questions about tricks!

[galimana]

Hello all again! i want to ask some questions and please help me!

1) Is it ok that my quaker does not do the trick inside the cage? (turn arround)
2) I don't use the clicker, is it easier with the clicker to learn tricks?
3) Where i can find a guide with tricks? (how to learn?)

Thank you very much!

[bmsweb]

1. You really need your bird outside its cage to train and preferably away from distraction.
2. It is much easier with a clicker for older birds. My babies are learning at the moment without a clicker or treats. This would have been close to impossible with my cockatiel who was 13 weeks old and not tame at the time.
3. there are heaps of books, i have "Parrot Tricks by Tani Robar and Diane Grindol"

Read Michaels thread on taming and all will be answered

[galimana]

thank you very much for your reply! I bought the book too! thanks again!

[JadeW]

In a joint answer to your first two questions; I don't train Cas when he's inside his cage (asside from the command 'home' to get him back in it). And the first few tricks I taught him weren't with a clicker, so it can definitely be done without. I do find the clicker a wonderful tool, but if you can't find one for under $5... I'd stick with no clicker.

And as bmsweb mentioned earlier, I also enjoy "Parrot Tricks" by Tani Robar and Diane Grindol is an awesome book. I've read it a couple of times, and it gives wonderful guidance. If you couple it with what Michale and the other trainers on the board talk about and do with their own birds, you should have no problem whatsoever

[Michael]

Actually, one major problem with that book... http://theparrotforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=278

[bmsweb]

I agree with you on Clicker training but like many things in life, it is never Black and White.

That book is just someone's opinion and what works for them. Anyone who follows one source of information with blinkers on is denying themselves an opportunity to develop an informed opinion.

The decisions I've made when breeding our conures is based on 5 books, internet research, mentoring by one of the Best breeders in Australia, along with the experience I've gained. At no point have my decisions been made based on the one source.

[Michael]

Thank you. This is exactly why I don't like that book. That book is adamantly against clickers for no apparent reason (I think it's politically motivated). I am not dead set 100% for clickers only. Heck, look at my wave training and you'll see that I ended up giving up trying to use a clicker to teach that cause it just got too much in the way. Also my first few weeks with Truman were all without clicker, I was just doing some informal training while he was still too young to train. On the other hand, it was invaluable for 20 tricks in 2 minutes and other complex behaviors. I don't like that book for specifically denying the reader the opportunity to use a clicker by being so against it. If that is the first or only book a new parrot owner reads, they will end up missing out on all the benefits of clicker training. Therefore (and all the reasons mentioned in my opposition article), I do NOT recommend that book or any other products by Tani Robar. Don't even get me started why I don't recommend the other authors/"experts" either. The only thing I'm left recommending is my own blog. Honestly, the reason I'm putting so much effort into doing it my own way is because I'm quite disappointed that there is no other reliable/unbiased training source that I can refer people to.

[bmsweb]

Honestly, the reason I'm putting so much effort into doing it my own way is because I'm quite disappointed that there is no other reliable/unbiased training source that I can refer people to.

Michael I honestly think your Taming/Training thread is one of the most concise and to the point written text on the subject on the Internet, but even you must realise that it is biased. I don't mean that in a negative way at all, its biased because its your opinion, which I might add I agree with.

All I'm saying is one has to be careful they don't close their eyes to what can be learnt. When looking for a book I didn't come across any I agreed with 100%, but they all give you ideas and that's what counts.

As far as the clicker section in the book goes I pretty much ignored it since I know already that clickers work and they work really well. Our baby conures are learning recalls, step up and down, turn etc without a clicker at the moment or treats. There are a number of reasons why I've gone down this path with them and its worked perfectly so far, that doesn't mean I wont be using a clicker further in the furture.

All I'm saying is one needs to be open to ideas.

[Michael]

All I'm saying is one needs to be open to ideas.

Exactly! And this is why I take such strong objection to Tani Robar. If someone ends up reading her book and nothing else, they will miss out on a lot of training potential just because Tani did not want to adapt to newer training methodologies. My philosophy is use a clicker when it helps, don't use it when it gets in the way. Tani makes an excuse to never use a clicker just to avoid rewriting all of her books. I think this is harmful to her readers because they might not get the whole story that way.

What I meant by my blog being unbiased was in a different way than you meant. Of course it is biased to what works for me. What I meant by unbiased is that since I don't make any money directly based on the training methods I recommend and the trainers/schools of thoughts I support, I can remain more objective than the ones that get paid to do it. They have to please editors, publishers, avoid aggravating competitors (like if their methods are too similar), etc. So what I meant was that my blog eliminates all of that sort of "parrot politics" bias.