Self-cleaning ovens?

[entrancedbymyGCC]

Not that this makes it acceptable but I thought they only reach 900F when they are self cleaning but only go 300-450 in normal use?

True. Wonder what 900°F would do to your Thanksgiving bird! Wowser! I just meant that the self-cleaning cycle temp is so far out of the safe zone it's a guarantee the material will produce the "fumes" that are so dangerous for our birds. I suppose if the place is well ventilated and the amount of the material is small they might be lucky and survive, but that's well past my risk tolerance and I'm the one who is willing to keep a few nonstick pots and pans around for special use. I am still using mine for normal cooking, I don't really have a choice at the moment. But I'm not excited about taking it to the higher temps or broiling. Mine goes to 500 for roasting I think and 550 for broiling, which is pushing the envelope a bit.

I should also add that apparently some self cleaning ovens use an enamel based substrate for the lining rather than PTFE based, so it is worth contacting the manufacturer. I just can't imagine using PTFEs in them is a good idea.

[Michael]

I think everyone is in consensus that a self cleaning oven running the cleaning feature would produce enough toxic fumes to kill birds in your household. I think the more subtle issue we are dealing with here is if ordinary baking use of the oven is safe or not?

[entrancedbymyGCC]

Well, not all self-cleaning ovens contain PTFEs. If I had an enamel-based one, I would be fairly comfortable temporarily removing the bird and ventilating well because the main issue would be the actual combustion products and carbon monoxide which are relatively easy to detect and vent (you can get CO detectors). With the PTFEs you are dealing with something that is quite a bit more toxic, and I don't know if the stuff is easy to vent, or liable to settle. I'd guess it is heavier than air and might be difficult to remove thoroughly. So is smoke, but at least you can see it. *MY* point was that I think it is somewhat shocking that this use of that chemical class is permitted by safety standards in this application. And I think there *is* an important distinction between PTFE-bearing and non-PTFE-bearing self-cleaning ovens.

And yes, I am slightly worried about the oven above around 400. Although since I've used it at higher temps before I knew what I had and my bird is still robustly healthy, I suspect we are OK. You *do* have to get the stuff to a certain temperature before it undergoes the changes that produce the fumes. As a general practice we close Scooter's door when using the oven or doing any other "smokey" cooking. And we do have a decent vent hood.