I'm thinking about purchasing an African grey

[poetax]

Me and my husband both love animals and would own lots of them if we didn't believe that would be a terrible relationship for both us and the animals. We have owned a cockatiel for over a year now, but it was agreed that it would be my husbands bird. I wanted to get an African Grey initially, however I needed to experience a starter bird with the cockateil. I have done tons of research on African Greys and really would like to own one. I realize the care they require and would like to ask some questions to see if I will be able to properly care for it. I get home from work at 5 with my husband getting home at different times every day. I will then spend 15-30 training the bird and playing with it exclusively. My husband and I are avid gamers. I plan on putting the Grey on a perch with toys that will sit next to my desk so that he can be with me while I play games, draw, or read, until I go to bed at around 12. On weekends I will have more time at home with him (I'm very introverted so I only go out to shop) Will this be enough socialization for a Grey. I picked this bird specifically for its calmness so I can have it near me while I play. We already do this with the Cocaktiel.

[Michael]

Glad to hear you are doing your research and take this seriously.

I would not expect an African Grey (or in fact most parrots) to be content to just sit on a perch while you do your own thing. That may be nice for you but it isn't necessarily for the bird. The only way people can "force a bird to sit with them" is to either clip its wings or keep it in a cage. Neither of these is ideal for the bird. So I hope you can drop this expectation and reconsider if without it a bird is unacceptable. My Senegal can't stay in one place more than 5 minutes and my Cape maybe half an hour. And this is only when they don't want to do anything anyway.

There are some exceptions. The macaw I adopted from a rescue really is happy to sit for hours on a perch nearby watching. She doesn't make any effort to jump off or scream for attention. You would be much better off looking for a Grey at a rescue considering some of your preferences. First off adult parrots tend to be more sedate in the first place. Secondly you may be able to find a bird who's personality suits you better. However, keep in mind that virtually all rescues cut bird's wings so it may not be the honesty representation of that bird when given the freedom/respect to fly.

But as long as you are willing to accept that the parrot may just prefer to roam around the house and chew up all your stuff rather than sit and watch you, then go ahead and keep researching and searching for your perfect bird.

[Wolf]

Hi, glad to have you here, and thank you for your question.
I have no idea as to how others on this forum will answer you question with the exception of one person. I have 3 parrots, one of which is a Congo African Grey female about 14 yrs. old. Unfortunately she arrived here naked except for her head, tail, and wings, so she is a plucker and that is improving.
I am usually up by 4 am and keep the lights down low so as not to disturb my birds sleep. They get up at daylight and we talk and sing for 45min. to an hour and then they have breakfast. After that I let them all out for about an hour. This hour is spent working with each one of them individually and lots of petting then they go back to their cages so that I can go shopping or work around the property ( 6 acres ) gardening or working in my work shop, things of that nature. Then sometime between 1 and 3 in the afternoon, it varies but mostly about one pm., I open their cages and spend the rest of the day playing with them until just before dark. They get fed in early evening when it starts to get dusk and go to bed by dark.
Although, my Grey is quite independent and loves to explore and find things to chew up or places to hide in, I still end up with at least 3 hrs. of one on one socialization and play time each and every day. Any less than this and she gets flustered and starts to pluck her feathers.
Their cages are in the main living area and so they also get attention anytime that I come back in the house for water, coffee or whatever. Since I am disabled I am back in for a few minutes about once every hour or so, until the pain subsides enough for me to continue doing whatever it is that I am working on. That should give you some idea as to what it takes to live with a flighted African Grey. I hope that this will be helpful to you.

[poetax]

This is good information, but I don't feel like I explained properly. I am much more worried that a parrot would get enough time and attention with me when I am home for work. I do not have time to wake up and sing with my bird for an hour each morning, so if that is what a grey needs then I probably cannot take care of it. We will both be in the room together and we already keep our Cockateil Totoro with us. He usually crawls around or sits on my husbands shoulder while we play. I'm not as worried if the bird will get into things, I mostly would like a bird that would enjoy being around me without tiring. We have a large multilayer perch that Totoro hardly touches as he prefers to be directly on or near us. I heard African Greys did not like to be pet as often so I thought he would prefer this method.
This is simply a description of the majority of days how I would spend time with a bird, there will be days I will spend longer periods of time playing with it, and doing more robust activities. I do not plan on clipping, we do not clip the cockatiel and we are thinking he is old enough to flight train. (the petstore had his wings cut when he was little so he never learned properly)

Would a smaller bird like a Conure be a better choice

[Michael]

The problem is that this:

I mostly would like a bird that would enjoy being around me without tiring.

is mutually exclusive with this:

I am much more worried that a parrot would get enough time and attention with me when I am home for work.

The kind of bird that would want to be around you a lot is the kind of bird that will pluck itself bald over not getting enough attention from you. You can't have it both ways. You can't have a talking parrot that isn't noisy and is quiet, etc.

[Pajarita]

Both Michael and Wolf are correct. Different species of parrots need different types of interaction and different lengths of time spent with them. A cockatiel is called a 'starter' bird because it's not as needy or as difficult to deal with or feed than other species. And although having a lone one is a lonely life for it (they are intensely flock oriented), it would not make much demands of you or be a big inconvenience except when it's sexually mature and starts calling for a hen constantly (which drives some people crazy). Grays are not like that. There is a reason why they are high on the list of more prone to plucking species, and the reason is their neediness and their hormonal surges. The kind of life you are planning for it would present both problems: not enough one on one time, not enough flying time, loneliness during the day (this translates into stress and anxiety for all parrots but most especially for grays which are normally high-strung), and terrible light schedule which will not only create a super hormonal bird but also depress his immune system something terrible (you can NOT put a bird to sleep at midnight forever - you can get away with it for a few years but it will have consequences in the long term).

I think that you should re-think the reasons why you want a parrot because I don't think that you are taking into consideration the parrot's needs and wellbeing although I give you credit for being honest about what you know will be able to do and what you won't. If I read your posting correctly, your plan is to train him for 15 to 30 minutes a day (there is no mention of playing, flying, cuddling, etc all activities that would please the bird, only training which, in reality, it pleases the human infinitely more than it does the bird even when it's well done) and then make him 'sit' on a perch next to you while you play on the computer or otherwise entertain yourself - while he does nothing for 6 or 7 hours until he is then put to bed in the middle of the night. My birds have each other for company 24/7/365, live cage-free in a birdroom just for themselves (so they can fly, chew, whatever), are kept at a strict solar schedule (which is the only schedule good for birds' long term health -not my opinion, a scientific fact) and I still make it a point to spend never less than 3 hours with them - and, in the summer, when the days are longer, I spend even more hours with them. Parrots are not good pets. They put huge demands on our time, our lives, our schedules, even our family life. They simply do NOT adjust to a human lifestyle, they don't 'obey', they don't understand discipline, they don't shut up when we have a headache, they don't sleep late when we are sick, they don't stay put when we want to work on the computer (mine has 8 keys missing precisely because I have one that spends time with me while I work on it)... We, parrot keepers, spend our life planning, programming, cooking, cleaning, tweaking something here and something there so as to make it reasonably acceptable for them and scheduling our activities around theirs.

[Wolf]

No, I think that you did a wonderful job of explaining what you were looking for, it is that you aren't looking at my reply correctly. This is my routine, not yours, and not anyone elses either. There must be thousands of differing approaches to this. What is important is that I tried to show you some of what life would be, if you are to have a happy and well adjusted Grey parrot. I have a lot of things to do and can't spend all of the time with them in one session and I don't think that most people can either. The early morning talking and singing thing is just me taking advantage of one of their natural activities. All of my parrots wake up and start talking and squawking and whistling right away, I just use it for interaction with them and they like it.
Instead of saying that you are thinking more of your own conveniences and not the birds needs, I tried to illustrate the birds needs by giving you a glimpse of one way of giving the bird what it needs in order to be happy and well adjusted. I wanted to show that they need a minimum amount of time from you and that it is fine if it is given in differing amounts throughout the day, but they still get that which they need.

[Elaihr]

I'd also like to add a piece of advice, from one gamer to another.

Parrots and gaming are hard to combine, in my opinion... The thing is, when you're playing, you usually get excited, and if you're using any kind of voice com you'll be talking too. You're clicking rapidly, fingers smattering upon the keyboard. My guess is that any healthy, curious parrot would also get excited by all this, wanting to know what's going on.

I've also tried to keep my parrot Penny entertained by attaching a myriad of toys to her tree, laid some on my desk for her to play with and so forth, but once I start gaming nothing else matters to her. She HAS to join in (which means, touching the mouse with her beak or jumping across the keyboard, not so great for gaming results, lol). And this is even on days where I've been at home all day, spending an entire day socialising with her, training her and playing with toys together. In other words; I don't think it's because she's under-stimulated. I think it's because she's healthy and sociable, and likes to know what's going on.

I don't even try playing during daytime anymore, as I felt like a complete jerk doing something that was fun, that she was not allowed to be a part of. Seeing it from her point of view, her SO was doing something super exciting, and I wouldn't let her help/join in. I know that would make me sad, if I was in her position. So, I've given up on playing during "her" hours and instead I try to keep it to the evenings after she's gone to bed. This works much, much better.

Also, I'm not saying you should quit living your life because of your parrot, there are things that must be done no matter what, like, cooking and eating. I haven't quit cooking or eating, even though she gets a bit upset when I take her to another room when I need to cook, but I do this mainly because I believe a cooking area could be very dangerous to a bird. Especially a curious one. But then again, cooking/eating and gaming are two very different things; I'm quite certain I'd live longer without gaming than I'd do without eating

So, if you do decide to get a parrot, consider changing your lifestyle a bit so that you won't have to push your parrot away from you. I've figured the easiest way to keep both yourself and your parrot happy is to adapt, not to force your bird to adapt. It's probably a lot harder for the bird, than it is for you.

[marie83]

Yup, Ollie wont let me play games (not that I have much time to anyway), he wants the controls for himself to bite and can sometimes get a little aggressive if I stop him. That's if he isn't wanting to be cuddled up to my hand.

[Elaihr]

Forgot to mention, Penny is usually very confident playing on her own, if I'm doing stuff that doesn't seem like much fun, like reading for instance. She wants to be a part of anything exciting though, and sadly my poker face isn't good enough while playing, obviously