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GCC Attacking Houseguest?

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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby marie83 » Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:12 pm

Y
Pajarita wrote:I don't think that the size or look of a hand makes a difference to them. They either accept any hand, they only accept certain people's hands or they don't like any hand at all.

As to stress, the problem with it is that, because they are 'programmed' to hide 'problems' (pain, general malaise, depression, etc), we can't really tell when they are stressed out unless wew are talking about super high stress that manifests itself in either acute depression or distress - and that even mild stress takes its toll (we now have studies about this). My biggest problem with stress and parrots is that captivity, even in the best of circumstances (cage-free, flighted, good fresh food diet, solar schedule, flock, etc), already puts them under both physical and emotional stress and, taking into consideration that stress kills, I opt for eliminating any extra and unnecessary stressors to their lives.

People compare a parrot life in captivity and life in the wild and reach the conclusion that life in the wild must be more or equally stressful than captivity because of predators, weather events, lack of food at hand, etc but what they don't take into consideration is that these animals took millions of years evolving to live under those specific conditions and that, throughout the millennia, nature tweaked and tweaked until she could provide them with coping mechanisms for them. To us, it appears that it's moere stressful to live in, say, the Amazonian jungle than to live in a living room in NYC but that's only because the Amazonian jungle is not our natural habitat.


Whilst I so agree with what you say I dont believe any animal would deliberately put itself in a stressful situation. Mine choose whether to interact or not, in thw begining introductions to strangers were carefully managed but the birds still got the choice. Ollie has always been interested in everyone whereas harlie always starts off in her cage and she chooses. Whether to come out and then whether to approach someone. Visitors are told not to approach the birds but to let them come over if they want to, they also know that if they dont like my rules they can leave.

Now if a birds actually attacking someone then imo it is clearly stressed and the whole situation needs a complete re-evaluation and action taken. Things to ask yourself at a minimum are:

Is the bird defending it mate?
Does it hate a certain sex?
Are you allowing the bird choice?
Does the person have a specific appearence that the bird objects to?
How does the person behave around the bird?
How does the person react to the attacks?
How is everyone else feeling and acting towards the guest?

Once you start looking deeper in to a situation the solution may become clearer. For me I prefer not to disrupt my birds routine because someone is visiting, I would look for a solution or consider asking the person who is clearly distressing my birds not to call round or only at times the birds will not have their routines interrupted by keeping them or the guest out the way.
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marie83
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby shiraartain » Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:12 pm

It can be said his anger can be seen as a form of stress or as an outlet for it, correct?

I realized I have not mentioned it here, but Fajr generally has free reign of the house when he's not in his cage for bed or after one of his baths. Our den is separated by a curtain from the rest of the house and that is where he typically is, usually with someone else in the room. The curtain is more a symbol for him that the rest of the house is not open for free flight than a prevention measure as he can climb onto the rod, climb down the other side of the curtain, and leave the room. He does not fly out when we are in the same room as him and have the curtain closed. If we are in the room and the curtain is open, he will make excursions to the other rooms, especially if they contain other members of the family. (If we are not in the room, we have him with us in one of the other rooms).

I'm mentioning this because it was an environment that Fajr was familiar with, with us in it and he is flighted and knows the layout.

He had an escape route available as well as his cage,play stand and us to go to for security, but instead he chose "fight" as opposed to "flight".

Edit: the more I think on it the more factors I see. His first molt has started, with many pin feathers coming out. This could have already put him in a state of stress? If so, then it is entirely my fault for not considering it. To be honest, I panicked because I thought he was plucking, but then searched for information and was so relieved to find that it was his first molt that I wasn't considering the stress.
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby Wolf » Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:23 pm

Since this is his first molt, could he be of the right age to be going into puberty? If so, that could be the underlying reason, perhaps.?...
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby Harpmaker » Thu Jul 10, 2014 2:31 pm

The pin feathers seem to be terribly itchy, but they can be painful if handled roughly. If Fajr had anyone be too rough, he might have been temporarily paranoid about anyone who might touch him. It might not take much.
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby shiraartain » Thu Jul 10, 2014 2:43 pm

Wolf, correct me if I'm wrong, but bird puberty in general is around 2 years, correct? Green cheek conures have their first molt at around 5 months to a year from what I know.

Harpmaker, our family members are the only ones petting him, and we are all gentle with him. I do so sometimes hit a feather the wrong way and he lets me know. Baths are the best thing we can do for him right now.

But going off of what you said, maybe he just doesn't want anyone outside of his "flock" touching him in this state.
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby Wolf » Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:20 pm

I had no idea as to their age when they have their first molt, none of my birds are that young and all but one came to me from places where they were abused and were all older. Thank you for the correction. And that is why I asked.
And since you mentioned it, it sounds quite plausible that he might not want strangers touching him, especially since he is molting.
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby shiraartain » Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:08 pm

What I still do not have a conclusive reason for is why he took the initiative and attacked her, but I am just going to put down to seeing her as a threat to the "flock" or being jealous.

I feel really bad for him, as he has many feathers coming out, and a cluster of them emerging just above his beak. Right now I can rub them, but pretty soon I won't be able to since it will hurt him and he'll just have to cope :(

Thank you everyone for your input. While I was sure he had to have had a reason, it also reminded me that it is presumptuous of me to assume I already know all the possible factors and I need to pay close attention not just to the environment, but Fajr as well when trying to analyze his behaviour.
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby Wolf » Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:10 pm

There is always a reason for what they do, although it is difficult to always know or even have a good idea of what that reason is. It would be easier if we could think and see the way that they do. Since they see into the ultraviolet, they see things that we are totally unaware of and that may have something to do with it.
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby Pajarita » Fri Jul 11, 2014 11:45 am

Parrots usually have their juvenile molt at around 6 months of age. It could vary because if the bird was bred off-season and/or kept at a human light schedule, this could screw up their endocrine system into giving the wrong signals. And yes, molting is itchy, stressful and sometimes a bit painful for them which makes them a bit grumpy.

As to puberty, it depends on the species, the smaller it is, the higher the metabolism, the earlier it will mature (and die) so, although parrots the size of greys or amazons would become sexually mature at 1.5 to 2 years of age, macaws would not until later (3-4) and little ones earlier (lovebirds at 9-10 months of age).
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Re: GCC Attacking Houseguest?

Postby marie83 » Fri Jul 11, 2014 7:07 pm

I cant remember exactly but going by his behaviour ollie hit puberty before he was 1 year old if that helps.
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