new odd behaviors...help?

[mulatte27]

ok so I am going to list some odd behaviors that Applejack has been displaying... here is the background, he is a 3 yr old male sun conure, was homed... they moved out of state and gave him back to the store/breeder... I got him six weeks later... he is in a 24x24x36 ish cage.. seed diet with fresh foods added... have had him about two weeks... I got him knowing he had some major issues with stepping up from inside or even outside of the cage... oh he is clipped and I have three cats lol

what I have noticed...
1. he truly is a sassy pants...
2. he will not let me eat-- meaning if I sit on the couch with any type of food (not beverage) he screams and screams and screams... even clamps onto the cage bars and does the aggression stance with some wing flapping.. I don't want to reward this behavior by letting him have any of my food so I ignore if possible but often end up having to cover the side of the cage that faces me
3. he seems to have regressed as far as any progress we have made... I knew bonding with him would be even harder after hearing that his previous family had him for 9 months and hardly took him out of the cage, but I had gotten him comfortable with a step up from the perch on the outside of his cage... now he wont even do that
4. he is screaming a lot... sometimes it seems almost random.. he will often sit on the perch near his food (on the side near where I sit on the couch) clamp onto a bar on the cage do the aggression position and scream... I actually like when he notices im home and that just was a few hellos and then he was done but now its happening throught the day (if im home to notice) and definitely in the evening when im home
5. seed throwing... this I noticed today when I got home from grocery shopping... he has been a lot messier lately... but today he was actually sticking his head in his food and throwing it around the cage... has proceeded to do this for approx. 15 mins straight... then stopped... then started again...
6. sleep for him has been an issue... I generally get up around 6:30 am ... I know he is supposed to get 10-12 hours of sleep right? I tried covering his cage at 7 and he tries to pull it down and screams... so I decided to move it back to 8... he seems better with that... however now that it is so much darker in the AM he doesn't want to wake up.... but I have noticed that even if im home he often takes a short nap... my other issues is that because he wont step up now I cant get him used to the sleep cage that is upstairs... I don't go to bed until 10 at least... and I hate that I am sitting downstairs watching tv while hes trying to sleep... I turn it down really low and have a thick blanket on the side of his cage that faces the tv and also turn out all but one light that is far from his cage to try and accomidate him
7. he dreams? or has some sort of interesting thoughts before actually falling asleep... he will sit and make kissing noises... small chirps... say his name.. and a few other mimic sounds... is this normal?

I know that was long but ive tried to find most of these answers on my own and haven't gotten clear answers...

[Wolf]

Really when I read what is happening, what stands out to me the most is that with the best of intentions you are still slipping into the one behavior that is the most counter productive to taming or bonding and that is separating yourself from the bird more and more. I know that you are not wanting to reinforce poor behavior in your bird, but the more separation that occurs, the more aggressive behavior the bird exhibits and then you separate him from you even more and so it becomes a self sustaining cycle and needs to end.
I think that you need to forget about punishment as a means of bringing about positive change in this bird. I understand that it could be difficult but you really need to ignore the bad behavior and reward the good behaviors. For instance eating, the reason that he screams at you when you are eating is that you are not following normal bird behavior and sharing with him and he is telling you that he wants to be included in this activity. Yes he may be doing it wrong, but he is trying to communicate with you. so ignore the fact that he is doing it wrong and share with him, this is a primary bonding behavior with birds.
Sometimes because of the way an animal or in this case a bird has been treated you must throw out the training manual that is in your mind, chances are the bird didn't read it anyway, and just deal with the fact that he is trying to communicate with you and go with that first. The more time that you can spend with him the better and you really need to stop free feeding seeds as the amount of protein causes an increase in aggressive behaviors. Leave him with fresh veggies to munch on during the day.
When you cover the cage because his actions are too distracting for you, you are separating the two of you. What you need to realize is that he is trying to communicate and interact with you, so take the time and interact with him and learn to communicate with him what you want him to do as well as learning to understand what it is that he is trying to tell you.
You got the bird because you wanted him and wanted a friend and wanted to interact with him and build a relationship with him so do that. It takes time, a lot of time, it takes understanding and patience a lot of patience and it isn't always easy but it is what you wanted so quit pulling back, commit to being this birds best friend realizing that friends call upon each other and that when they need help and understanding it rarely happens at the right time or in the right manner. Try to understand that in most cases aggression is nothing but an expression of fear and you would be scared too if you were this bird. Try and figure out how you would feel if you were in a totally new and strange environment with a strange new giant who doesn't understand you and to make it worse the previous giants were not nice to you and you could not trust them. You try to tell the new giant what has happened but it doesn't listen to you and just keeps pushing you away when you try to tell it how you fell. Try to look at this with new eyes.

[mulatte27]

ok... I came in with dinner tonight... soup and crackers.. and saw him starting to get antsy... almost like he was prepping for screaming so I set my bowl down and took a cracker over to his cage. He watched me break off a piece and eat it... then I broke off a piece for him and gave it to him. He then came all the way to the front of the cage and we took turns eating tiny bits of cracker, the whole time I was talking to him and reassuring him. I then walked away and had a few bites of soup (he went into his hut and mumbled a few things) and then he came back out. He seemed to just be observing what I was doing. Because he was calm I talked to him and he perked up and I happened to have a cracker in my hand so I shared again. So I see what you mean with the eating thing...
My only concern with this is that I don't want him to think that he will always get to eat whenever someone else is eating... like if I have company or something...

the thing im having most trouble with is the screaming... its always obvious that he is trying to communicate with me... I get that 100%... whether it just be "hey don't forget about me im so cute and fluffy" or "what the heck are you doing!".... how do I figure out what he is trying to tell me if all he does is scream and show aggression/fear. there is no way for me to not get up and walk around my house-- I even try to not go terribly close to his cage when he seems agitated as to not make it worse. But when he is on the outside perch and screaming non stop I try to go over and figure out what it is that he needs. Ive tried playing a mimicking game, sometimes I will sing to him to see if that calms him, I will squat down so he does not feel like I am a giant standing over him... if he is screaming when I am not paying attention or when I walk away then why does he cower and deny contact when I get closer and give him attention?

wolf while I sometimes don't like how you say things I value what you say... its obvious you know what youre talking about.... and im sure Applejack is happy that you are teaching me how to be a true member of the flock... he told me to ask for your number and to put it on speed dial so he can just tell you whats wrong and you can fill me in! hahahahaha

and do your birds have any sort of night noises they make before or as they fall asleep? its so darn adorable... hes doing it right now actually

should I still cover him up when I am downstairs and it is past his bed time? obviously not wanting to punish by taking myself out of the picture but at the moment for instance he is in his hut falling asleep... I still have some work I have to do before I can even fathom going to bed... should I cover him so he can have darkness and sleep or no because he needs to know im here?

[marie83]

Personally I havent experienced the flock eating problemy things with any of mine. The only time mine eat is at their own meal times, during training sessions or food I put in foraging toys and they all seem more than happy with that.
Just wanted to say you dont have to share your own personal food if you do want to all eat at once though, you can give him his own healthy food. Crackers are high in salt and other crap.

[Wolf]

Marie is right in that you don't have to give him your food, you should use his healthy food for this, but you do want to take a nibble of it so that it appears to him to be the same as yours. He cowers and moves away from contact because he is scared. He is also hardwired to need your company so his mind and his emotions are a big battlefield over this. He is trying to figure it out but his mind was never meant to have to deal with this sort of paradox. It is possible that he was punished for being a needy bird and that could account for the fear, but I am guessing on that.
There is no reason to not go ahead and cover his cage when it is time to go to sleep, unless it causes him problems. It seems to me that he would be better off being covered, just make sure that you allow for air flow in the cage.
Tell him he can call my crystal ball anytime he wants, but it is a lot like cable TV in that it goes on the blink at times.
I know that I am not the most tactful person, but I do try very hard to be as gentle as I know how to, and yes, I need more practice at it. I am not that much of a people person, I am an animal person and that is who I am trying to benefit here, after all it is a bird site and not a people site.
For now, I think that the best thing that you can do is to respond to him with your presence and some words of encouragement for him as that is what it appears to me that he wants and needs, but it is not what he is expecting to receive, thus the fear.

[mulatte27]

I'll relay the message about your crystal ball lol.... I'd say you're probably right about being conflicted... it's so obvious that he wants attention and affection but he just doesn't seem to know how to handle it . This morning went good with breakfast... Gave him a grape and a peanut while I ate. He was screaming a while after I uncovered him.. while I was in the kitchen making breakfast... i talked to him to reassure him I was still there and when I walked by the cage he did the aggression stance...

So you don't leave seed in the cage during the day? Do you have set feeding times for seed and other than that it's fresh fruits and veggies?

[Wolf]

I feed gloop and fresh fruit and veggies for breakfast and all day munching and I feed a seed mix about one or two hours before sunset.
Please describe this aggressive stance that you keep mentioning to us.

[Pajarita]

Ok, a few pointers:

1. Sun conures are, along with quakers and Jendays, the birds that scream the most so get used to it because this is the way they are. And, sometimes, he won't be really asking for anything but merely making contact calls (they do them even when they are perching on your shoulder, it's part of the species typical behavior and why people give them up).

2. He won't go to sleep unless he is exposed to the sunset. It's not a matter of covering his cage and going from light to dark, their bodies (and ours) don't work like that. It needs the lowering of light to start producing melatonin, the hormone that makes you (and them) drowsy (it takes 20 minutes for humans but there have not been any studies with birds as far as I know).

3. Same thing in the am, he needs to wake up slowly with the sunrise.

4. He needs to eat after sunrise and right when the sunset starts so, if his cage is in a room where you are at night, this needs to be addressed.

5. He stepped up before because he was in the honeymoon period, he is over it now.

6. Like Wolf said, no free-feeding seeds but also not just veggies, they need cooked cereal grains mixed in with them.

7. I don't have a whole lot of experience with sun conures (only had three) but, going by my personal experience and what I've read from other owners, they tend to be more aggressive than other species. Having said that, they also say that Jendays are the same but my Jenday is the sweetest little thing.