Trained Parrot BlogParrot Wizard Online Parrot Toy StoreThe Parrot Forum

Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Chat about general parrot care and parrot owner lifestyle. Bird psychology, activities, trimming, clipping, breeding etc.

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby idlepirate » Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:56 am

see now i could write an essay about the machine but I know youll just have to try say something against it and we'll just be going on and on haha. Basically Im a therapist not a scientist, I was trained how the machine works but i find it hard to explain the whole science of it, i just like to see my own proof and if i see it works then i believe it works.I have been using it on my customers, friends and myself and its worked. its not a "heat lamp". its a lighttherapy machine not a heattherapy machine. its the light which heals. there is a slight warmth which some people feel and others dont feel it at all. and as many people that have tried to copy it, its the only polorized healing light with the medical acreditations and certificates that it has.its not some random item you find on the home shopping channel. biopton.com will only try sell you the machine and give you the basics of it. read up some of the PUBLICATIONS, SCIENCE AND RESEARCH from here
from other doctors and scientists:
http://advancedlighttherapyuk.com/publi ... earch.html
and this is one of the only videos i can find on online, really old one but it gives you extra info:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuzAAbTghKM
and i really do hate these oldfashioned videos about healing things, but its the best one i could find lol.
The thing with this company which i like is that nobody is allowed to advertise what this machine can be used on without it having been through the medical trials first and the problem proven to be helped with or even cured. Everything it says it can do is backed up with proof, certificates and medical trials. It was designed for burns and wound healing in hospitals and they then made smaller cost effective machines for home use because they found out that it works pretty much with almost anything.its just handy to have around. as i have said i have used it on myself and customers and wouldnt have started a career out of it did otherwise. i didnt tell everyone to go out and buy one, only that its an option as we were all giving ideas out and commented that its what i use over winter if needed. I do feel I have to defend it and i understand that as a scientist you want to look into things more but please dont assume and critizize it from reading picture on one of the websites. the light spectrum is as it is so that there are no bad effects, if it went into UV then there would be risks of cancer the same as sunbeds. It uses the whole range of visible light and just a little bit of infared(which is why you might feel some heat). kindof like getting the good out of sunshine without the bad UV sideeffects. its polarized light not just a yellow light bulb. it penetrates into the skin- into the tissue to biostimulate the cells. you cant heal wounds, burns and skin conditions with just a heat lamp. or leg ulcers for that matter. Id suggest you look for a bioptron consultant near you and ask for a demonstration and test it out for yourself if you want to prove it wrong. I respect people and their opinion and i like the fact that you look into things more then just follow along and believe everything you hear. So that we havent hijacked the thread completely if you want to ask me anything else on the machine feel free to PM me but ill leave the thread as is now so other light options for birds can be mentioned again too ;)

sidech wrote:It's okay to do that, Entranced, but I'm wondering if there isn't another way to say it, maybe a not so " destroy all my hopes and beliefs way " ?

Thanks for the support sidech :) . it was just a idea to put out about sunlight i didnt mean to get into this whole debate hehehe, but i do have to defend it the best i can. sorry for rambling:) im glad the homeopathy worked for you and that you're all better. thanks again for your comment.
User avatar
idlepirate
Conure
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 211
Location: UK
Number of Birds Owned: 1
Types of Birds Owned: Blue Throated Conure
Flight: Yes

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby Michael » Fri Jan 28, 2011 1:57 pm

I think the point that Entranced is trying to make is not that the machine may not be beneficial to people or parrots but that it does not provide a full spectrum (including UV) to parrots as would daylight. Therefore the machine may not be a complete substitute for sunlight. The UV part of the spectrum is important for the parrot's extended color vision and for processing calcium/vitamin D. The machine may or may not have healing value but from the data provided, it is not a complete substitute for sunlight or ideal full spectrum lighting.

Whether or not the machine is beneficial to parrots in other ways is a different topic than the discussion about sunlight substitutes. Feel free to start another discussion if you would like to talk about alternate benefits the machine provides to parrots. This is definitely interesting and could be helpful to people. But in this topic, let's try to go back to winter sunlight.

To get the topic back on track, I want to ask if anyone knows of any kind of liner for pet carriers perhaps with an electrical heater built in that could line the carrier while leaving some part open for sunlight?
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6204
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby entrancedbymyGCC » Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:47 pm

Michael wrote:I think the point that Entranced is trying to make is not that the machine may not be beneficial to people or parrots but that it does not provide a full spectrum (including UV) to parrots as would daylight. Therefore the machine may not be a complete substitute for sunlight. The UV part of the spectrum is important for the parrot's extended color vision and for processing calcium/vitamin D.
.

One of the points anyway... Yes, no matter how you slice it, it does not provide the UV and the UV is what is needed to get the uropygial gland to produce vitamin-D precursor. This device will not do that. Infrared light will not do that. Now it is also true that the UV components of sunlight are the ones that can be harmful... this is a goldilocks kind of thing where too much or too little are both bad. Do birds sunburn?

I'm not sure how much the extended visual range really affects them. You would think if it was a big component, they would not fly into glass, because glass would look very different from an opening. But they do, so it must at most impart the equivalent of a slight tint. Although if the house is never lighted with full spectrum light, maybe there isn't in fact enough contrast. Do birds kept with full spectrum light fly into window glass less often?

To get the topic back on track, I want to ask if anyone knows of any kind of liner for pet carriers perhaps with an electrical heater built in that could line the carrier while leaving some part open for sunlight?


They make a lot of things like this for cats. We have a heated bed our older kitties adore. It's basically just like a heating pad made for humans, but in a well-sealed claw-resistant plastic cover that is, in turn, inside a fuzzy cover. They also make high thermal constant packs you can put in the microwave and then slip inside a fuzzy cover that would stay warm for a period of time.

Or you could go with a thermo-perch.
Scooter :gcc:
Death Valley Scotty :cape:
User avatar
entrancedbymyGCC
Cockatoo
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 2106
Location: Southern California aka LALA land
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Green Cheek Conure
(Un)Cape Parrot
Flight: No

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby Michael » Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:57 pm

Avian Sun claims that "without UVA, birds are essentially color blind!" This is absolutely preposterous. In the absence of UV, parrots would at most have their range of color reduced but far from color blind. The closest thing I can imagine the lack of UV vision to be would be comparable to being unable to differentiate violet from blue. Even that is probably more extreme than reality with lack of UV. To anyone that doubts if parrots can differentiate colors, I of course always refer them to my ring on peg by colors trick.

But as for the outdoor winter carrier concept, do you know of a battery heated carrier cover that could be used to keep it warm (and better yet so warm that the top can be uncovered for sun exposure?
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6204
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby entrancedbymyGCC » Fri Jan 28, 2011 3:30 pm

Since heat rises, I think using a heating pad in the floor of the carrier would work better than using a cover. You would have to worry a bit about poop, and if it is REALLY cold you might want to wrap insulation around the bottom part of the carrier.

The thermo perch idea might also get the job done. The idea being that warm feet plus rapid circulation would keep them fairly warm even in a cold environment.

Of course this is easy for me to say, it is 71 outside right now.
Scooter :gcc:
Death Valley Scotty :cape:
User avatar
entrancedbymyGCC
Cockatoo
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 2106
Location: Southern California aka LALA land
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Green Cheek Conure
(Un)Cape Parrot
Flight: No

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby patdbunny » Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:31 pm

How cold are we talking about here? A nice healthy bird can handle quite chilly weather. Another forum I'm on just discussed taking birds outside in the cold. Several people take their birds out in the day time when the temps are 40 degrees in full sun. A fully outdoor acclimated aviary bird can withstand nighttime dips into freezing temps (I know - some mornings I have to crack the layer of ice off of water dishes).

I'm just saying 10-15 minutes a few times a week outside with you to get natural sunlight is not going to hurt a healthy bird and can only benefit. Of course I'm only talking about healthy birds not sick, plucked, too old, too young. And not in the rain, in high winds, etc.

I'm all about the natural. I hold a lot of skepticism for manmade artificial anything.
Roz

There are in nature neither rewards nor punishments — there are only consequences. Robert G. Ingersoll
User avatar
patdbunny
Amazon
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 579
Location: east san diego county, CA
Number of Birds Owned: 30
Types of Birds Owned: sun conure, parrotlet, cockatiel, african greys, eclectus, sun conures, jenday conures, indian ringnecks, parrotlets, bourkes.
Flight: No

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby Michael » Fri Jan 28, 2011 6:13 pm

We haven't had a day in the 40s for several months now. I kept my parrots out in the outdoor aviary down to the low 50s and upper 40s. Lately it's been freezing and well below. Right now it's not even sun that is my biggest concern but transporting them for some things I have to do with them to begin with. Temps have been 20-35F around here and wind chill on top of that.

I don't think natural sunlight is worth chilling your bird for but if I can come up with a good heating solution that ensures the carrier temp doesn't go below 50, I might take them out a few times a week to briefly get some. They were better acclimatized to cold when I was keeping them in the aviary daily than now after being strictly indoors for months so I don't think anything below 50 is ok.
User avatar
Michael
Macaw
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 6204
Location: New York
Number of Birds Owned: 3
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal Parrot, Cape Parrot, Green-Winged Macaw
Flight: Yes

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby patdbunny » Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:19 pm

When I travel w/ babies that still need heat, I use a heat pad under my carrier. I got a car lighter pluggy thingy at walmart: http://www.amazon.com/Powerful-Convenie ... B002KBSLG2

I've also used the handwarmers taped to the outside of my carriers when I can't plug in:
http://www.campingsurvival.com/handwarmers.html

I prefer the reusable ones that you boil to recharge instead of the disposable ones. The disposable ones need air circulation and sometimes taping it against a carrier doesn't provide enough air. I also like this: http://www.amazon.com/Dex-Products-Grab ... d_sim_ba_1
It's larger and provides heat longer.
Roz

There are in nature neither rewards nor punishments — there are only consequences. Robert G. Ingersoll
User avatar
patdbunny
Amazon
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 579
Location: east san diego county, CA
Number of Birds Owned: 30
Types of Birds Owned: sun conure, parrotlet, cockatiel, african greys, eclectus, sun conures, jenday conures, indian ringnecks, parrotlets, bourkes.
Flight: No

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby Ryan416 » Sat Jan 29, 2011 9:05 am

I can understand keeping the cage away from drafts is ideal as they are stuck inside, but a perch beside the window is perfectly fine IMO. My Ruppell's loves to sit on the window sill and look outside, fly away, then fly back as soon as the sun pokes out again. It's drafty and often cold but her toes and beak are always warm at this time from all the excitement. I could be wrong! But I think the difference in temperature for short periods of time should be fine for a healthy bird with a good diet. I know when she's feeling cold because she will fly up to the light fixture and roost for a while. Keep in mind that even in tropical regions the temperature can drop to 15C degrees and rain.

This obsession with UV protection and "energy efficient" homes conflicts me. Most of us are lucky enough to live in a city or town with perfectly acceptable air quality, yet we often seal up our homes and never let sun or fresh air inside. Children these days often have allergies to nature and asthma problems from being inside or "protected" 24/7. I think birds should not be treated the same way, they are almost "wild", they have natural tolerances to sunlight and temperature variances. Most likely much less tolerant to the chemicals found in building materials, household cleaners and fabrics such as carpet. Just my opinions... I look at elderly relatives who grew up with NO climate control, hours in the sun every day, non engineered diets and they seem to be quite fine at 80+. Same with parrots in the wild who live a very long time if they avoid predators or serious injury.

Full spectrum lights are a nice idea but keep in mind that the fluorescent radiation has been proven to cause side effects in some people, maybe birds too as it is NOT naturally produced light.
User avatar
Ryan416
Cockatiel
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 50
Location: Toronto
Number of Birds Owned: 1
Types of Birds Owned: Ruppell's Parrot
Flight: Yes

Re: Winter Sunlight Solutions?

Postby rones » Sat Jan 29, 2011 11:28 am

I live in greece so sunlight is taken for granded but the winter cold is something else...fortunally that 's a problem we face from 3-6 months a year...my solution is a well lightend (with lots of windows) and warm house... :budgie:
:budgie:
User avatar
rones
Lovebird
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 29
Number of Birds Owned: 1
Types of Birds Owned: male budgerigar
Flight: Yes

PreviousNext

Return to General Parrot Care

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests

Parrot ForumArticles IndexTraining Step UpParrot Training BlogPoicephalus Parrot InformationParrot Wizard Store