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Senagal - how long grumpy, pissed or hurt feelings?

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Senagal - how long grumpy, pissed or hurt feelings?

Postby cledford3 » Mon Feb 21, 2011 12:42 pm

Sunday I went and visited my parrot - who will be coming home Wednesday from the petstore. The visit started out great with with him coming to me (and stepping up) as soon as he heard my voice. Things were going great (he was really open to pets and scratches) until I got bored, decided to try the shoulder thing and the situation went downhill :-( Since my previous post about ear interest, he'd shown no further interest in either going to my shoulder or messing with my ear, so I was wondering what the deal was. For lack of other things to do, I shouldered him by placing him there myself - intending the lure him back down with treats. Things didn't go as expected :roll: As suggested by others, his interest in ears has evolved from cute little mouthing to full blown chomping! (I think he thought it was a toy...) That was not fun - but did teach me a great lesson...

Anyhow, I wasn't about to tolerate it as it HURT, so stuck my finger back up to my shoulder for him to step up onto (something he's become virtually automatic about over the last several days) not thinking that he might actually be enjoying his efforts to amputate my ear ;) The short of it was that he decided that instead of stepping up (as I mistakenly assumed he'd just automatically do) he bite my index finger instead - hard! He chomped down, broke the skin right beneath the nail and then started to "scissor" his beak back and forth - he's like a little pitbull! So, This was not the end of the world to me and I didn't pull my finger back - in fact I left it there thinking, "how bad can it be?" I thought that if he saw biting the finger wasn't a path to success, we'd be able to move onto something else. I was OK with this because In the dog training I'm involved with I get bitten all the time. Granted this is with protective equipment on (I'm a nationally certified trainer), but I've chomped by the best - GSDs, rottweilers, pitbulls, Dobermans, malinois, etc., you name it, I've been bitten by it (on purpose) in training - so I figured I could "take" a tiny little parrot until he gave up! This was until the point he started "Scissoring", the situation had "devolved" to where I decided that he needed to be some where else other than on my shoulder attempting to chew my finger off. I was leaning on a chest high display area where he typically hangs out. It is is a big, square display for the parakeets, with a wire-mesh top on it. This is where he spends his time on display. (On the top) Since it was chest high and he was on my shoulder, I brushed him off with the back of the hand he was chewing. He fluttered down fine and was no worse for the wear. Just very pissed off. I don't want to sound like a an animal abuser or anything, I leaned my shoulder down as far as I could and it was probably 12-18 inches max.

Anyhow, he was quite irritated and didn't seem to want "make up" over it. He would approach an offered treat - but otherwise was done with me. Not in what I gathered was due to fear as much as just being pissed at me. I took about a 10 minute walk around the store and came back and he was still not his warm (to me) self. He would again approach for a treat but wasn't running right to the sound of my voice. He also was somewhat more reluctant to step up, although did 2-3 times for treats and verbal praise.

My read after the 10 minute walk was that he was still upset over the encounter. I'm fine with that - while it was MY mistake, it needed to end and it did. In the future, I obviously need to think situations through BEFORE they happen and control them by hopefully not allowing them to occur in the first place. Having said that, I'm sure I'll make other mistakes as I get the hang of this and possibly, even make no mistake at all, but still might have a pet having a "bad day" and I need to stop the behavior that manifests.

Any advice on dealing with situations such as these in the future? Was the brush off OK? I recall mention of "shrug offs" for misbehaving parrots on shoulders, but I didn't want to allow him to win by withdrawing my hand so did what came instinctively to me in the situation and used the back of my hand. It wasn't a smack, it was simply a brush which he moved away from more than me making contact.

Regarding the angry or hurt feelings - I guess we'll see how he is tonight to see how much trust was broken. I'm assuming/hoping he'll have recovered/bounced back but won't know for sure until I see him. In the mean time, is it common for the Senegals to get hurt feelings (or get pissed off) and how long do the typically need to recover? This whole encounter was over in less than 20 seconds and while I'm new to parrots - wouldn't think it was so traumatic to damage our relationship for ever - but I would like to give him his "space" the times I do upset him and was wondering what the general guidelines are.

Also, a lot of this may have been due to him being tired and cranky. I mentioned the encounter to the avian dept manager as we were leaving and explained what happened. She told me that he'd had a rough day already. First, he fell into the parakeet display (through and uncovered portion) and later that a customer/visitor just prior to us and had spent a lot of time with him. Evidently, the guy was having the parrot do a lot of steps ups and other activities that she thought had "wore him out." After talking the manager then took out a ball for him to play with and upon doing so he really started kicking it's butt - with lots of biting, tossing, wing flapping and chasing it. So, while I certainly didn't help the situation, maybe he also had a lot of pent up aggression he needed to channel as well?

Thanks for input.

-Calvin
cledford3
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Re: Senagal - how long grumpy, pissed or hurt feelings?

Postby cledford3 » Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:53 am

Went back this evening. No hurt feelings and everything back to normal.

-Calvin
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Re: Senagal - how long grumpy, pissed or hurt feelings?

Postby cledford3 » Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:56 am

By way of a more comprehensive update - we went back last night and he was back to his normal, sweet self. No issues stepping up, definitely wanted to be with me, was open to accepting head scratches, preening my hands, allowed himself to be picked up, was climbing all over me (excluding my shoulders - I would simply block him with a flat hand and then treat as soon as he moved back to the center of my forearm) - so things seem fine.

I thin I got a really nice parrot. When I got there he was in his cage actively playing and entertaining himself with a climbing toy, yet he transitioned nicely to wanting to be with me and hanging out. I'm looking forward to bringing him home tomorrow evening!

Thanks,

-Calvin
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Re: Senagal - how long grumpy, pissed or hurt feelings?

Postby sherillynn » Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:56 pm

I think each bird has their individual timeframe for how long they'll stay mad at you. With my macaw, when we go to the vets, she stays mad at me for up to a week. That's the only thing I've found that really ticks her off. She won't even take her favorite food from me (almonds) until I have been punished for a good long time!

My ekkie on the other hand gets mad for about 5 minutes and then has to be back near me playing ASAP. She is only 2 and I think she just cherishes our playtime too much to hold a grudge.

I just got a Jardine's and so far haven't seen her get upset yet so I cannot comment on that.

Glad you've already made up with your bird. I wonder if some of the other folks at the pet store that visit aren't teaching him bad manners too? Just a thought.

Sherill :macaw:
I once had a sparrow alight upon my shoulder for a moment, while I was hoeing in a village garden, and I felt that I was more distinguished by that circumstance that I should have been by any epaulet I could have worn.
Henry David Thoreau

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Re: Senagal - how long grumpy, pissed or hurt feelings?

Postby entrancedbymyGCC » Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:32 pm

I don't think I've ever had one of our two get angry at me for a training related interaction, and I think the kind of reaction you describe sounds as if he really did not understand why the thing that happened had happened and it slightly affected his trust in you, at least for that encounter. I agree you can't just quietly allow a bird to chew your finger off and sometimes you have to do what you have to do to make it stop, I'm guessing he really didn't understand why the brush-off had happened. FWIW, if you approach from behind with a finger or hand, you can usually get an almost reflexive step-up, which might have allowed you to end the interaction more gracefully (although with a bird on shoulder it takes a certain degree of physical flexibility that not everyone has!)

It is a really good sign that after a nice break, he was ready to start over with a clean slate. But personally I'd take it as a bit of a cautionary tale to be careful to keep training interactions clear and not to confuse him, because it sounds as if he doesn't much like being confused. MHO, I'm pretty new at all this and I may be reading it wrong.

As for how long they can bear a grudge.... my :gcc: certainly seems to be able to stay agitated and unhappy with me for 2-3 days. Happens every time I travel anymore. I got a pretty good chomp this morning (he hangs on like a bulldog, too, when he latches on, he generally gets transported some distance by the beak before my conscious mind overrides the reflexive movement) because I misread his degree of having relented. We got back last night from a 3-night trip. I've gotten to be able to read his body language pretty well and I try to leave him alone until his mellowed out, so this one was totally my own fault.
Scooter :gcc:
Death Valley Scotty :cape:
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