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Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby windharper » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:15 am

In the presence of the bird or not, I'd agree preferably not, but I still think the broom needs to go. Placing something else on top of the spot where Bailey chews might be able to stop him from chewing there.

There's no easy solution, however, I think Mona is doing the right stuff like wearing shoes. If you show the bird that biting feet won't do anything, it will learn not to bite. The shoes allow you to do so without fear or hurt. Once the bird stops, you can go without shoes and hopefully it won't remember difference between with or without shoes.


I agree.

I have noticed that Senegals can get quite roused up and aggressive when on the floor. Sometimes Kili will hop around with her shoulders high and bite the first thing she sees. What is it about the floor and Senegal Biting? Is it their insecurity of being low that drives a bite or flight response down there?


All Senegals? Very interesting...and not my experience with Tamber at all. When he's on the floor he will come over to me and physically pull himself up along my clothing. Nothing violent. If I am not close, he will go over to the highest thing he thinks he can climb...again no aggression. It does pose for some interesting acrobatics at times. :D

Deb
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Mona » Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:09 pm

Hi Deb:

Thanks for your comments and ideas. Also, thanks for sharing your experiences. It sounds like you have a closer relationship with Tamber than I do with Bailey. Bailey really does prefer men for some reason and really does want to be with my husband. Bailey is okay with me and definitely has the propensity to entertain and make me laugh, but I really don't spend much time with him on my shoulder. For one thing, my hen Babylon won't tolerate that - but even out of her sight - Bailey is a bit edgey with me. I honestly wonder if a lot of this is flock dynamics. Bailey has some fear of Babylon, perceives that she and I are close allies....so he just doesn't 100% trust me. To put it simply, the friend of your enemy is my enemy kindof thing.....but not quite so extreme.

As far as removing the broom.....I probably need to rethink the broom because it clearly is an aggression trigger for Bailey; however, not a simple solution because Bailey seems to want to chew up the door and I need to somehow keep him from approaching and doing that (because I like the door whole - not decorated with parrot bites).

The scenario is that: Bailey and the flock are in a bird room with tons and tons of things to chew up. I have pictures of that room on my website www.flyingparrotsinside.com. The birds have a Get-a-Grip and tons and tons of boxes, wooden items, bird toys, junk strewn every where. When Bailey came to my house probably three years ago, he wasn't really big on toys. I don't think his owners gave him very many for much of his life. He's much better about toys and chewing wood up now (be careful what you ask for) and he WILL get distracted from the door and find something to chew appropriate if I am lucky.

A funny story is that Kiri (my grey) really likes to wander around the bird room and find and chew wooden objects up. Bailey isn't always a big talker but there are days when I will hear the funniest little conversations going on in the bird room. I will peak into the room and Bailey will be following Kiri around and just chatting away with her. I can't always understand what he is saying but he's very enthusiastic. As far as I can tell, she pretty much ignores him and just keeps chewing on whatever has her interest. I wrote an earlier post about the day he said quite plainly to Phinney, "What do you think you are doing?" when the two of them confronted each other and then took off flying across the room.

I think my problem has more to do with the fact that Bailey will get a bug in his head and just want OUT the door and away from the rest of the flock every once in a while. He wanders over to the door, sees the wood and chews the moulding around the door. Kiri has also done this on occassion but she is extremely easy to distract and doesn't get aggressive. The real solution would be either disposable doors or marble doors but that clashes with my decorating dreams :lol:

I agree with you that I think being on the floor does lead to aggression issues with a lot of parrots. When loose in the birdroom, my flock has a lot of freedom so it isn't worth arguing with them about being on the floor. We do have cheap carpeting so I quit worrying about what's going to happen to that. Also, they are only loose like that for an hour or so a day so destruction is kept to a minimum. I really find that it is easy to clean and it's one way to have a flock of parrots as companions without feeling like we live in an aviary with them. The floor aggression issues aren't really a problem or any thing I can't handle but it is something to be aware of and to keep in mind. It they were running around in our living space, I could see that it would be a problem because they would be chasing feet. When they are in the bird room, people are not in there with them and I just go in every once in a while to check on them or run an errand and when I do that, I just keep a close eye on where every body is and I wear SHOES. They have different rules for living room (and our living space where we relax) vs bird room (people not relaxing in the room with them)

So...Thanks for your thoughts on this! We are still a work in progress....

Mona
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Doug (spousal unit)
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Barneyboy » Thu Jan 14, 2010 2:19 pm

Hi, I have a 3 year old male senegal (Barney) and a 2 year old female brown head (Betty). They do not live together as Barney can be a bit of a bully to her but they do play out together, feed and groom each other. We have had them both from 12 weeks and they are very tame and loving most of the time!

Over the last week Barney has taken to 'going for' Betty and has bitten her foot twice causing a cut and bleeding - I may be being an over protective mum but I just wondered if anyone had any ideas as to why Barney has 'turned'. Is this normal behaviour?!

Thank you!
:senegal:
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Kathleen » Mon Jan 18, 2010 11:31 pm

What were the events that led up to the bite? Did one bird invade the other's territory?

You may have to keep these birds separate and not have them out at the same time if one continues to be aggressive toward the other for the safety of the bird that is getting attacked.
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Kathleen » Fri Jan 22, 2010 10:50 pm

Today I worked on grab/handling taming with Michael's bird, Kili. I started by putting my hand above her and at first she tried to walk away from my hand so I had to try again and reward her before she decided to walk away. It took a few repeats until finally I could touch her back with the palm of my hand, and then wrap my fingers around her, and then finally, grab her and lift her completely off of her perch.

We took a break from this and then again, 20 minutes later we did some more of this type of handling for some pieces of banana. I was able to grab her without any bites during this session about 10 times, maybe a bit more. I might have to repeat this kind of taming with her during training sessions for a few months and maybe I'll be able to grab her any time without biting in the long run.

I also started to use variable reinforcement when I was doing the taming with the pieces of banana. I would not only do grabs, but I would also cue a trick and ask her to step up sometimes to mix up the session.

And I didn't use a clicker. I don't want this to become a trick and have to carry the clicker to do this with her.
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Kathleen » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:35 am

There was another grabbing/taming session with Kili recently but not for banana, just for seeds. I was able to grab her on the first try without a bite. Later, I was trying to push the threshold and I would grab her and then try to play with her beak or pet her head, and she was getting more nervous about it. I did hold her neck between my fingers so that she couldn't twist her head around and bite me but I must have loosened my grip a bit because she got nervous one time and turned her head and gave me a bite (not a serious one, she didn't have the leverage for it). I pushed her head back up and out of biting reach of me again, and waited until she stopped struggling to get out of my grip. Once she calmed down, I still gave her the treat. I think it would have been worse to let her go completely after the bite. I may have pushed it too far that one time and she got nervous. Getting the bite was bad but nothing she wanted came out of it so I don't think that it hurt the progress.
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Kathleen » Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:12 am

The most recent session with Kili went decently well. She seems to accept a grab during training sessions. I haven't tried this yet when it's not a training session so there is still much progress to be made. I was told that I linger too much and this makes the bird nervous, so I have been trying to not linger as much. She seems to walk into my hand on most attempts, but other times I guess I did linger too long, she didn't know what I intended to do and tried to walk away (on her perch) or flew off of the perch.

Another behavior that I have been working with her on is her beak scratches. This is when she is laying down on her back on my leg, I hold her onto my leg with my finger around her neck area (just to hold in place) and with the other hand, I scratch her beak and play with it with my fingers. I figured that she would be nervous to do this with me at first and for a long duration, so the first thing I did is lay her on her back on my leg and just held her there (but not for long). I think the really important thing is when you are pushing the threshold of a bird's trust/tolerance, you need to make sure you reward them before it becomes too much. In this case, I wanted to reward on the first time right away before she realized what was going on too much and tried to struggle or bite (out of fear). If I do push the threshold too far (I did this once or twice when I carried her across the room (in a grab) and she got very nervous. Then what I did to save the situation a little bit is to wait until she stops struggling and then give her the treat and let her go and eat it. We worked on beak scratches and 2-3 times later (and a day later) she seemed to relax and let me, but not for a long time.
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Kathleen » Tue Feb 09, 2010 12:48 am

Today I tried to do grab training with Kili while not during the typical training session time. She kept trying to bite me. She just didn't understand that it's not a trick and that I would reward her for it even though it wasn't training time. She seemed to accept it after a few grabs and rewards. She bit while I was putting my fingers around to pick her up and I got my hand in the position that prevented her from biting and did it anyway. I scratched her beak for her and made it rewarding, and then gave her a seed.

There's still more to be done, she just has to learn that I'll give her treats for it even if it's not during formal training.
Kathleen
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby Suzzique » Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:30 pm

I have to agree with Mona about males not bluffing. While we have not had Martini dna tested with everything we have read and his size in general we are pretty sure his is a male. Matini never bluffs. If he goes for you he is going to bite and bite hard enough to draw blood. Also the distration thing does not work on him.

The biting for no reason is common for Martini though only with me. I do not understand him at all. If I'm sitting in the living room he will come over and sit on me. Most of the time he is good. However he does growl at me quit a bit when sitting on me. I'm not sure what that means other than he is warning me to be good maybe? He has bit me when we are eatting dinner and I'm reaching for something that is near him. Even though he has his own. Yesterday was the worst. I was sitting reading and he was sitting with me. I hadn't done anything not even truned the page for the book. The next thing I know he is attacking me and bit down threw my fingernail into the fingernail bed. I am at a point that I just don't know what to do any more. Even though I'm not his "ONE" I am his primary care giver. I'm the one that gets them up in the mornings, gives thier fresh food, toys, cage cleaning, talk to them, treats you name it. The only thing my daughter does is give him attention for a bit when she gets home from school and she puts him to bed at night and covers him up. She does give him treats but not as much as I do. I would rather take a bit from my grey than from Martini. I never take him out of his cage. I open the door and he comes out on his own when he feels like it. Putting him into his cage I have him step up on a stick and put him in that way. Though even then he has gone for me. Boy he is quick. I only clean cages when the kids are home so that they can each take a bird into thier rooms. Otherwise I do get bit. With Alex I know it's his age (he is 2) and this should pass as he gets older.

Any suggestions would be most welcome.
Alex - cag
Martini - senegal
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Re: Senegal Parrot Biting and Aggression Issues

Postby pchela » Thu Feb 18, 2010 4:08 am

Do you know how old Martini is? Senegals can be a bit schizo at times. I am Pippins favorite person and also the only person in the house that gets bit by him. I've read and been told that In the wild, a male would bite his mate to warn her of danger or to get her to do something he wants. I believe that Pippin bites me to warn me of something he perceives as a threat or out of jealously of the other birds or my husband. You say that you are not Martinis preferred person though so I'm not sure what this biting is about. I do know that sometimes when things are quiet Pippin will just sit still for a while with his eyes open. If I approach him during this time he will bite and bite hard and then immediately be fine and loving. I did some research and it seems that birds can kind of nap with their eyes open so they will be alerted to any danger kind of like a trance. If disturbed during this time they will react strictly out of instinct. I wonder if something like this is what happened when you were reading. Just a thought.

So, I'll also ask for some advice. Pippin has started screaming loudly at my husband whenever he gets near him. I thought it was because Pippin always wants to be with me and my husband would often take him off of me and put him away so I had him stop doing that and he is also the one to give Pippin treats now. Its been a few months and the screaming at my husband is only getting worse. He will still step up for my husband and never bites him. Thoughts?
"I bet the sparrow looks at the parrot and thinks, yes, you can talk, but LISTEN TO YOURSELF!" ~ Jack Handy ~ Deep Thoughts
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