Diggy to the vet and toys order

[Strawfrawg]

Jeez, I'm starting to realize how lucky I am in the vet department. Mine is awesome. He always presents multiple estimates for procedures and explains what's needed vs what's just recommended or available, and he even takes payments rather than not have an animal treated when it needs to be. I've never once felt overcharged or underserviced.

It's definitely good to have a vet lined up. Because many cities have few avian vets, you may not be able to get in easily as a new patient so it's good to have a well visit so you're in the system in case something happens. In one city where I had just moved, I had a hell of a time getting Weebo seen for a broken, bleeding feather with a shaft I couldn't pull out because the local avian vet couldn't get me in. I ended up driving a couple of hours to a vet school and it was traumatic for both me and my bird.

The relative rarity of certified avian vets gives them license to charge a premium. That sucks. with flea markets selling birds to whoever happens by, there are a lot of bird owners who probably never take their bird to the vet after hearing the cost.

[Eurycerus]

It sounds like if I take Nika I'll go to the other, further away, avian vet. I probably should bring Diggy to that vet instead but I'll get a first opinion from this person and see what they say. I accidentally scared him a couple days ago and he's just now coming out of his pouty mode. I've been a complete stress case over him for weeks but it really got bad the last couple days where he would barely look at me and would growl and poof up if I got close. I've been super depressed and worried sick over him, so hopefully he's okay. He seems in a better mood today a little bit at least. :[

In happy news, I think Nika is loving the foraging I'm doing for her pellets. I must be making it too easy, but I was afraid that she wouldn't be able to figure out. Well she did! I'm going to step it up tomorrow, add another bowl or two (I bought four) and fill up the foraging toy. Does anyone know where/if pistachio shells are available? I had saved some and cleaned them to use for foraging but she threw them all out the first day so now I shred paper to mix in with the pellets to make it difficult and cover the bowl in paper towel.

[Eurycerus]

So Diggy got a full work up done and I will get the results next Friday I believe. Here's hoping he's okay!

Also just got all the information written by his owner from when he was surrendered. He apparently can talk (he hasn't since he's been with Mickaboo) and was pretty much cared for by a woman which is promising. Currently he prefers men and has regressed significantly in the past week, which is disappointing. I'm starting over and taking it really slow. Also I have confirmation that he's older than 15 years. That's mighty old! Poor guy, to be given up after growing up and living 15 years with the same people. I definitely am going to need the help and awesome support of you all. I know it took a long time with Nika for us to be on good terms and it's only been four weeks or so with Diggy, so time will tell. He's such a sweet little thing. It makes me so sad that he's all depressed and quiet right now. :/ It could be sickness but I actually think it's because he traumatized himself, ejecting himself from his cage while I was cleaning. I try to be so calm/slow moving but I'm just going to have to try harder.

[friend2parrots]

poor little Diggy - hoping his test results come back alright!

I'm sure with time he will come around, especially after his wings grow back. I've heard that fearfulness is easier to deal with than overt aggression, not sure if you've found that the case with Diggy...but either way, you're doing a great job with him so far!

[marie83]

Poor diggy, I'm glad he has found you though.

[Eurycerus]

I have to say I'm having a tough time dealing with the failure of the huge regression. He's even worse than when he came to me. I feel unbelievably guilty. All I'm trying to do is help and obviously I'm failing somewhere. :/ I know that he's had too many scares and blames me for them, so there's a pretty bad association now... Any suggestions other than time and not having any more bad associations? I try to give him a treat anytime I'm nearby and doing some very minimal targeting. I'm working on just sitting next to him and talking too.

I did just have one big realization. So he has manzanita perches and one rope perch. When I'm around or he's feeling nervous and we're working together he flees to the rope perch and I think it's because he has a better footing. Since he falls when he tries to fly he probably is terrified of slipping and therefore wants to be on the rope perch as often as possible. Damn... it's so depressing.

Also the vet called and said he has too much of a particular bacteria that he probably acquired from his first household and therefore should be put on antibiotics. Great... something traumatic for me to do to him :/ Crap.

[Andromeda]

Don't blame yourself or feel guilty. You're not doing anything wrong and he probably regressed just due to the trip to the vet. You are giving him a good home and you are being very patient with him! He is a lucky little bird! It's not your fault he was re-homed after 15 years or that someone completely botched his wings.

My Poi was a terrified bird from the getgo but was making progress with me until I had to take him to the vet about a week after I adopted him, at which point he regressed badly. I wasn't ever able to recover from that because he had ~20+ vet visits within a year. With Diggy hopefully it will just be the one vet visit so you can work forward from there and be able to make progress. Stay positive.

I'm so glad you brought up the manzanita perches! Manzanita perches are very slippery and are the worst for a fearful bird that is prone to falling. I had to ditch the manzanita perches I had when I first adopted my Poi and I replaced them with several rope perches of different diameters, a sandy perch, and two dragonwood perches. Honestly anything is better than manzanita and it's great that you've identified the perches as an issue because that gives you something you can change to help make Diggy feel more secure!

Honestly you are doing all the right things; giving him treats when you're nearby, minimal targeting, and just sitting near him and talking to him. Time and (hopefully) no further bad associations are the only thing that will help a fearful bird. It took time but my whole family is really amazed with Jimmy today because they remember how he just used to fall off his perch in fear if they came to visit but now I can put him on a t-stand and cue tricks like wave, turn in a circle, wings, etc. and he will perform for them. He's still a cautious bird but he doesn't fall out of fear anymore. No, I can't touch him with my hands and I can't get him to fly but even after 4 1/2 years I consider it a work in progress and one day I hope to teach him to be okay with hands and fly by using positive reinforcement.

Diggy will come around for sure but it will take time! I will share one thing I learned very recently that's helped improve my relationship with Jimmy that might help with Diggy. I'd been doing clicker training with Jimmy for about a year but it didn't improve his attitude towards me. Then I read something on the BirdTricks.com blog that helped. Now, I'm not a huge fan of BirdTricks.com mainly because I think their products are hugely over-priced and they make misleading claims but I have to say this idea worked really well: Putting happy on cue.

Basically what you do is use capturing to reward a behavior that the bird is doing while he's happy and then you put it on cue. In Jimmy's case it was stretching his wings but other suggestions are: playing with a favorite toy, swinging, taking a bath, fluffing up, whistling, preening, shaking tail feathers, scratching its head, or perching on one foot. It really doesn't matter what you choose as long as you choose something that you know Diggy is doing while he's happy.

Since I "put happy on cue" with Jimmy he will actually solicit my attention which is something he has never done. A few times a day he will run excitedly over to the perch closest to me and say, "Hey, birdie? Hey, birdie? Hey, birdie?" until I look at him, and then when I look at him he just stares at me intently because he wants to do tricks. He has never done anything like that and this is new behavior as of February 2013. You have to understand that he knows other tricks such as wave and turn in a circle but over the past year he never would "beg" for treats using those tricks or solicit my attention. It's very different now that he knows "wings" and I have to give BirdTricks.com credit for giving me the idea to essentially "capture happiness." It worked with Jimmy in a huge way. He still doesn't like me but I have noticed since I "put happy on cue" that he actually spends a good amount of time sitting as close to me as possible whereas in the past he specifically sat as far away as possible. He even solicited a head scratch from me yesterday (a first!) but I am too scared of a bite so unfortunately I had to turn him down.

[Eurycerus]

Thank you for the wonderful advice I'm trying to instigate it currently. He made a few moderately friendly noises instead of growling at me which is better than nothing.

It's so tough trying to do the right the and making Diggy worse and worse. I really needed to clean his cage last night because I had been trying to give him space inside his cage for a couple days. I put his play stand next to the door in the hope he'd climb out of his own accord but unfortunately no. So i approach very slowly and open the door. He sees the rag and flips out. Thankfully I was able to stop in time since I was going slow so no harm done. I realized the one trip to the vet had made him terrified of white towels. I bust into tears and just sat there. I ended up using a green rag but I'm just so upset about everything. I've made him so much worse in such a short period of time....

[marie83]

..... I've made him so much worse in such a short period of time....

Right stop talking like this because you haven't made things worse, you have suffered a setback which in the grand scheme of things can be overcome, it may seem like you have though and I 100% get the tears and frustration from what feels like a massive battle with Harlie, even know its still ongoing, we were doing excellent since she was on meds last night and I was at the point I felt able to start touch training. The thing is each setback we have we get a faster recovery from it, thats partly me changing approach but mostly its from her as the bad memories are slowly being replaced with better memories.

You keep working at it and you will get there. Your totally amazing for not giving up like others would. This bird may never be 100% tame but you will improve this birds outlook towards people, I promise.

[Andromeda]

I agree with Marie: I totally understand the tears and frustration but you mustn't be so hard on yourself or see it as "I've made him so much worse." It's just a setback and it happened because you took him to the vet. You have to think of it this way: you are doing good things for him because he turned out to be unwell so it's good that you took him for a check-up! I understand you want him to be less fearful but his health is more important than his tameness.

With a fearful bird your biggest asset is patience and persistence and you seem to have both so Diggy is a lucky bird to be with you. The only thing that will help is time. Progress might be slow and you might have setbacks but you have to focus on the positive things. For example you said he "made a few moderately friendly noises instead of growling" so that's something!

The "putting happy on cue" is SO HUGE and I wish I would have known about it years ago. I just learned about it in January and although I had been doing clicker training for a year prior to that and had taught several tricks I saw more of an improvement with "putting happy on cue" than anything else I had previously done. I don't think it's necessary with a tame bird or a young bird but for an older bird that has issues with aggression or fearfulness or tameness I am convinced that is the number one step you should take when training. I promise you that if you spend time rewarding a happy behavior and put it on cue his attitude will improve and it will establish a foundation for further training. It may take a few weeks to accomplish but you can do it!