Animals with rights - and so it begins...

[Wolf]

I never even considered that mankind could be trusted for anything. Law don't change things people do. I can't tell you how many laws are on the books that are not enforced and for some of them that is a good thing but not in all cases. As to the people that do these horrible things to animals, some of them believing that the ends justify the means, well I would be satisfied for them to be executed, but that ain't right either. Again it is not the law that I resent but the need for laws when we already know what is done is wrong.
I hate to think of the torture and loss of life that gives us the information that you and I are sharing right here and now on the forum. We can't trust people to do the right thing simply because it is the right thing. We can't trust the lawmakers to craft a good law and even when they seem to we can't trust that the law will be enforced properly. Can I give up because of these hurdles? No, I can't and the only thing that I have to try and help is education to try to make the birds lives more tolerable at the hands of their humans. I do sign petitions to stop these atrocities and at one point I was one of those activists doing a thankless job in what can only be called unlawfull activities. I really don't know what else to do, but I am still at least trying and that is about all I can say.

[Pajarita]

Yes, bad people will continue doing bad things even when they are illegal but, at least, a law that really protects animals from cruelty will change the industries (food, fashion, entertainment, breeding, selling, etc) treat them and even if there was no other improvement (and I don't believe for one second there will not be!), that would be more than enough reason for me to support a new law.

As to a good law versus a bad law, I happen to think that the Swedish bird law is pretty darn good and I seriously doubt that the members of the parliament who wrote it and passed it know more than any of our congressmen when it comes to pet birds needs. Worse comes to worst, all they would have to do is copy it... Not that it will happen any time soon here because the USA is a democracy in name only, in reality and to our shame, we are living in a plutocracy.

[liz]

Pajarita, I agree. We need the Swedish laws. On all pets.
Florida has a law that a horse has to have at least an acre.

[Wolf]

I also thought that the Swedish law was a very good step in the right direction.

[Pajarita]

Well, there you go! That's all I am talking about: laws that give the right to animals to have a life free from abuse at the hands of humans.

[Wolf]

I came across an update on this that you might want to know about.
http://phys.org/news/2015-05-lawyer-con ... .html#nRlv

[Pajarita]

Well, I don't hold out any hope that the judge will allow it but the whole case is a step in the right direction and, eventually, it will happen. See this:

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/this-p ... ar-BBjXEFF

[Navre]

I'm with Michael on this. More laws and more government power is almost always a bad idea.

[Wolf]

I have no choice but to straddle the fence on this. I am not in favor of more laws or government intervention, but what to do when people refuse to do the right things when they know what they are. I know that we need some laws, but like many others, I also see how the laws are often ill thought out and written in such a manner to be abused, it is scary.

[Pajarita]

In my mind, it's all a matter of what matters most to you. And the suffering of animals is what matters most to me and what, in my personal opinion, needs to be eliminated. Now, it is a sad truth that, unfortunately, we can't trust people to do the right thing out of the goodness of their hearts. If we could, there would be no crime, no bigots, no haters, no abusers, no nothing bad... but we all know we don't live in Utopia but in the real world where people will do all kinds of bad things if there were no laws. And animals are 100% vulnerable to all kinds of cruelty for the simple reason that, at most, people who abuse them get a 'free pass' out of jail because, under the current laws, they are nothing but property, just like a table or a chair. And that needs to change. People talk about 'education' been the ticket but there has never been a single radical change to society's 'morals' born entirely out of education... not slavery, not segregation, not religious freedom, not child labor laws, not women's vote, nothing! -not a single example where education actually worked without laws backing it up so why do people think that after thousands of years of a system not been successful it's now going to work? Makes no sense to me...