A Bulbul tale...

[Chris&Akilah]

it's a fine line to walk when you keep birds...ALL our birds are wild animals, whether they were bred in captivity or not. Your birds grandparents, great grand-parents, possibly even parents, were stolen from the wild and forced into captivity, ensuring their ancestors will never live as they were meant to. I think all of us should keep that in mind and feel a certain amount of guilt about it. We can't deny the fact parrots are not meant to be kept in a home any more than a squirrel or songbird. No matter how tame and friendly our parrots are, they are and always will be wild animals, not domesticated. Even if you didn't buy your bird from a breeder, and rescued it, just buying the products associated with bird keeping sends the clear message that we want birds as pets so they will continue to be bred in captivity, and therefore occasionally poached and smuggled to satisfy demand. I just think we, as parrot keepers, don't really have the right to judge others for attempting to keep wild animals as pets (unless of course its something that endangers people, like big cats, primatees etc.)

[captwest]

That was well said, i agree,

[Roger P]

I agree as well. A well thought out response Chris.

[liz]

Nevermore, I wasn't trained for squirrels. Because of my illness I could not take the shots required for handling mamals. I was trained for birds and reptiles. My favorite was a vulture named Oscar who could not be released. He was in an outside habitat. When I would go out to have a cigarette I sat on the rock beside his cage. He came down and showed me a game he had. He had a rotten stump with pebbles in it. To amuse himself he moved the pebbles from one hole to another. We played tug of war with tree twigs. When I would give him a big leaf he would smash it up and give it back. I miss him and the others.

[Nevermore]

I agree with you Chris. But we CAN make an effort to protect the ones that are still wild, by limiting ourselves to the birds that are bred in captivity and fighting against the black market animal trade. The captive bred birds cannot survive in the wild 99.9% of the time (some can be rehabbed). They don't have the skills to. Thus they don't have the option of returning to the wild. My opinion on the matter is to keep the wild animals wild, and give the 'captive' ones the best life you can.

At the same time, not all wild animals could make 'good pets'. And its dangerous to try because of the many zoonotics out there. Too many people think that any animal can be turned into the perfect pet, and have no clue about the risks involved. If I had my way, we'd be limited to the animals that are already used as pets NOW. And never 'domesticate' anything new.

You were lucky with that Vulture Liz. in my experience, they're more difficult to handle than hawks, falcons or eagles. While the other birds of prey rarely even think of using their beak on you, Vultures WILL. The ones I met were not the friendliest either. Unreleasable educational birds, that liked ONE person. Everyone else...? Their eyeballs made really nice targets!

[liz]

The biggest probelem I saw at the rehab is they were taught not to associate human emotions with the animals. That upset me. I introduced Oscar to some volunteers just the way I saw him and he accepted them too.

You just have to take the time to see.

I agree with you Chris. But we CAN make an effort to protect the ones that are still wild, by limiting ourselves to the birds that are bred in captivity and fighting against the black market animal trade. The captive bred birds cannot survive in the wild 99.9% of the time (some can be rehabbed). They don't have the skills to. Thus they don't have the option of returning to the wild. My opinion on the matter is to keep the wild animals wild, and give the 'captive' ones the best life you can.

At the same time, not all wild animals could make 'good pets'. And its dangerous to try because of the many zoonotics out there. Too many people think that any animal can be turned into the perfect pet, and have no clue about the risks involved. If I had my way, we'd be limited to the animals that are already used as pets NOW. And never 'domesticate' anything new.

You were lucky with that Vulture Liz. in my experience, they're more difficult to handle than hawks, falcons or eagles. While the other birds of prey rarely even think of using their beak on you, Vultures WILL. The ones I met were not the friendliest either. Unreleasable educational birds, that liked ONE person. Everyone else...? Their eyeballs made really nice targets!

[Margaret]

Last year in April boyfriend's dog found out little creature in the bushes. It wasn't moving, no noise, nothing- we didn't know what it is at that moment. Dog was walking around and crying like she want to tell us: take care of that "bambino". Long story short: it was raccoon. We took him home, hand feed him with goat milk, give him a couple of nights in a emergency cage and give him to rescue shelter only because it was raccoon and we both realized that little "bambino" will be monster soon.
I admit it was hard to give him to shelter after hand feeding.
Couple of years ago the same dog found out little bird(I don't even know what kind of). The bird was shaking and crying. My boyfriend feed him, give him cage and after a while let him decide- bird fly away.
I'm positive that if bird would choose to stay - he would stay with him. We all know that part of animals are wild, but little bird wasn't a lion or even raccoon.

I couldn't express myself better than Chris&Akilah

[Nevermore]

The biggest probelem I saw at the rehab is they were taught not to associate human emotions with the animals.

Actually they were right to do that to a certain degree. You do NOT get attached to the animals. Because the majority of animals that end up in a rehab, get euthanized in the end. Or die on their own.

People have the tenancy to anthropomorphizing animals. Animals do have emotions. But not the same kind as humans. ESPECIALLY when they're wild. They think we are predators out to kill them, no matter how 'nice' you are to them, how much food you give them. They see you, and they expect to be dead any minute. They think you are there to eat them. They don't hide because they're shy, they are not huddled on your hand because they're cuddling,they're COWERING, they don't growl because they're mean. They're trying to survive. And humans to them, are a threat. Cooing and talking softly is not going to help. You just have to do your job emotionlessly. If it bites you. Its not being mean, it doesn't mean you can 'punish' it, it doesn't give you the right to hurt it back or not give it the care it deserves. It doesn't know you're trying to help.

I think by telling people not to associate human emotions with the animals, they're trying to prevent the volunteers/employees from thinking that certain animals are 'mean', or 'shy', or getting too attached to them. They're also trying to prevent them from being human imprinted from too much attention, or being neglected because someone 'doesn't like' the animal.



I hope you were very careful with that Raccoon. I would rather deal with a porcupine than a baby Raccoon, those things scare me. Cute, cuddly, fuzzy....carriers of Rabies, Distemper, and Raccoon Roundworm among other things.

Rabies isn't as common, but Distemper and the round worm; 50% of Raccoons have distemper, which your dog SHOULD be vaccinated against. If not....it could be very dangerous for them. 'Mamma Coon' A rehabber I met awhile back who focuses on Raccoons told me once that she has to euthanize 50% of the coons she sees, because they have Distemper.

Raccoon roundworm is evil. It is an internal parasite that is passed from mum to baby. Most of them have it. The eggs can infect humans, and tend to travel right to the brain. They can blind you, give you brain damage, and kill you. They can also get into your bloodstream and block major vessels and result in the death of muscles, loss of limbs, etc.

And the best part is; these eggs are almost immortal. Nothing short of a blowtorch will kill them (Literally. They DO blowtorch the cages). They can survive months in a jar of ethanol and still be infective. You can stick a Raccoon corpse in a freezer for months, and you can STILL get infected by it.

You can catch it simply by handling a raccoon and not properly washing your hands. You have to assume anything that comes into contact with the coon, is now covered in the eggs. Real Rehabbers wont even use any cage a raccoon has been in, for any other animal than a raccoon simply due to the risk of passing on the parasite to other animals.

[Margaret]

(...)I hope you were very careful with that Raccoon. (...)
You can catch it simply by handling a raccoon and not properly washing your hands.(...)

We were. We knew the risks, but it didn't stop us from helping baby animal even if it was wild. We both knew that we couldn't keep him as a pet.
What I'm trying to say, is that I understand your worries that people often doesn't realize that wild animal is still wild animal- even if it looks cute. We did knew, but on the other hand we couldn't left couple days old baby-animal hungry and cold, because his mama was killed or just left him.

For us this Raccoon was still a baby to rescue... Maybe we are weird couple

Picture, to prove we were careful:

[Nevermore]

Cutie!

I'm not saying don't help them; I'm just providing a warning. The more people that know the risks, the better. If it means that someone who would have picked up the baby coon and cuddled it, and pet it, and decided to 'keep' it...doesn't.