Adult Senegal claims it's starved/Pellets pointless?

[Michael]

Aye, Northern Parrots is a great store, I buy most of my parrot stuff from there. It's not exclusive to the UK either, they deliver worldwide I think.

BTW, they are the only store in the UK to currently carry Parrot Wizard NU Perches. Check em out.

[marie83]

Aye, Northern Parrots is a great store, I buy most of my parrot stuff from there. It's not exclusive to the UK either, they deliver worldwide I think.

BTW, they are the only store in the UK to currently carry Parrot Wizard NU Perches. Check em out.

I really can't see the perches listed, not even when I search for them. Are they called something else over here?

[Pajarita]

You need to take your birds to an Avian vet and run a CBC, an avian chemistry and a bile acids test because they seem to be starving and that's a symptom of advanced liver disease which, if you have been free-feeding seeds all along is perfectly possible.

I don't feed pellets (yes, they are mostly an American 'thing' -they don't use them in South/Central America, Asia, Africa and most of Europe and Australia) because I don't believe they are the healthiest option when it comes to a bird that eats only fresh plant material in the wild, I feed gloop and raw produce for breakfast and a small, measured portion of low protein seeds for dinner. To give you and idea,my senegals get one tablespoon of a budgie mix and a nut every other day for dinner.

[billy-1]

Actually, a 1 kg-bag of pellets should last two senegals at least 3 weeks, not one ! That puts the cost down to roughly ~3£/week, surely thats not too expensive ?

My birds are bigger than yours and they go through 1kg in about 3-4 weeks.

hi i order big bags of seed first of all that works out cheaper just get a container so its sealed , i have 5 african greys i brought 1 kg of parrot seed and between the 5 african greys it lasted 3 days , i cant see how you say its expensive , the problem that i find is choiceing the right food people say pellets i go for the real natural food to me its obvious its seed i understand you get alote of goodness in pellets but if you feed fruit and veg that gets the ballance but my advice of buying what you want example seed , pellets is buy a bigger bag you safe more money and if the life time on it is ok then whats the problem buy it

[Pajarita]

LOL - No, dried oil seeds are not part of their 'natural' diet. Their natural diet is fresh plant material with a few green nuts and seeds. By feeding the amount of dry oil seed you are feeding to those greys, you'll end up destroying their liver (fatty liver disease) and damaging their kidneys (high uric acid).

[KC Cameron]

Pellets are for the convenience of the owner. It is more labor and research intensive and expensive not to use pellets and still get a balanced diet. On the other hand, fresh food is what they eat in the wild and is better for them (and us too) if given in a balance. Every species eats different things in the wild, so in reality, one size does not fit all. Fat, protein and sugar are big items that you should be aware of in any parrot diet, and it is different with different species.

In reality, most of us can't/won't give a balanced diet without pellets. Pellets help provide a variety, but should be heavily supplemented with fresh veggies and some fruit and sometimes protein sources like eggs.

The seed mixed you see at stores are generally VERY unnatural for parrots, and comparisons can be made to a heavy "Twinkie" diet in humans.

Generally speaking, most experienced aviculturists would agree that TOPS pellets offer the best nutrition available, followed by Harrison's, then Rowdybush. All should be supplemented with other natural foods.

[GreenWing]

Yeah... as KC Cameron says, I do think pellets should be more supplemental to a parrot's diet, which really should be based on fresh foods.

According to my avian vet and several other people that are experienced with parrots: if you're going to give pellets, go with Harrison's. For some reason, they think Roudybush is among the "worst"... not sure why as this was news to me, but it's worth looking into...

[Pajarita]

I don't like pellets, period, but, if I had to go with one, it would be TOPs and not Harrison's. TOPs contain no soy (and that's a big issue to me), they are higher in water content (much healthier to a digestive system that is meant to eat food with a water content of 85 to 95%) and its vitamins are derived from food (Harrison's are lab made which are not as efficient as the natural ones).

[KC Cameron]

Corn, soy and peanuts are known allergens in some people and birds. Unprocessed Soy is also poisonous?? Corn is a filler. Unlike dogs and cats, parrots can live over 100 years - an excellent diet is VERY important.

Here are the top three popular pellets (when it comes to health) in the US. Make your decision.

TOP (Totally Orgsnic Pellets) http://totallyorganics.com/t-pellets.php
Ingredients:
Certified Organic Ingredients: Rice, hulled millet, barley, alfalfa leaf, sunflower seed hulled, sesame seeds unhulled, quinoa whole, buckwheat hulled, dandelion leaf powder, carrot powder, spinach leaf powder, purple dulse, kelp, rose hips powder, rose hips crushed, orange peel powder, lemon peel powder, rosemary whole leaf, cayenne ground, crushed red chili peppers, nettle leaf.

TOP also has this disclaimer (the others don't):
TOP pellets are an important part of a complete diet. Feed approximately as much as your bird will consume in a day. Some days birds will eat more than others so the amount will fluctuate. Discard the remainder and feed fresh pellets each time. Consult your avian veterinarian if you have any specific diet related concerns. Although an excellent source of protein, vitamins and minerals, we believe that no pellet can provide 100% of a bird’s nutritional needs. Please be sure to feed vegetables, fruits, nuts, and some seeds for a varied diet.

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Harrison's "ADULT LIFETIME COARSE" http://store.harrisonsbirdfoods.com/ADULT-LIFETIME-COARSE/productinfo/ALC/
Ingredients:
*Ground Yellow Corn, *Ground Hull-less Barley, *Ground Soybeans, *Ground Shelled Peanuts, *Ground Shelled Sunflower Seeds, *Ground Lentils, *Ground Green Peas, *Ground Toasted Oat Groats, *Ground Rice, *Ground Alfalfa, *Psyllium, Calcium Carbonate, Montmorillonite Clay, Ground Dried Sea Kelp, Vitamin E Supplement, Sea Salt, *Sunflower Oil, Natural Mixed Tocopherols, Lecithin, Rosemary Extract, * Algae Meal, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Dl-Alpha Tocopheryl Acetate, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement, D-Calcium Pantothenate, Niacin Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, D-Biotin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Folic Acid, Zinc Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Calcium Carbonate, *Vegetable Oil.

*CERTIFIED ORGANIC INGREDIENT


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Roudybush "Daily Maintenance" http://www.roudybush.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=orders.group&group=premium
Ingredients:
Not found on their web site (does that tell you something????)
Ground Corn, Ground Wheat, Soy Meal, Soy Oil, Calcium Carbonate, Dicalcium Phosphate, Salt, DL-Methionine, L-Arginine, Niacin, Mixed Tocopherols, Rosemary Extract, Ascorbic Acid, Citric Acid, Lecithin, Silicon Dioxide (carrier for liquid antioxidants), Alpha Tocopherol Acetate (source of Vitamin E), Ascorbic Acid, Manganese Sulfate, Yucca shidigera Extract, Hydrated Sodium Calcium Aluminosilicate, Dried Yeast, Biotin, Calcium Pantothenate, Zinc Oxide, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Vitamin A Acetate, Thiamine Mononitrate, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (Vitamin K), Ethylenediamine Dihydroiodide, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Folic Acid, Cyanocobalamin (source of Vitamin B12), Sodium Selenite (on Calcium Carbonate), Propionic Acid, Ammonium Hydroxide, Acetic Acid, Sorbic Acid, Tartaric Acid, and Natural Apple Flavoring.

[Pajarita]

I don't think that corn is bad for parrots because, if it was, mine would all be dead by now as I feed it (fresh, not dried!) everyday (it's part of the basic gloop recipe - and, once a week, they get corn on the cob as their daily veggie). They absolutely adore it (the canaries and finches do too) and Lord knows the farmers back home have a heck of a time keeping the wild ones away from their crops!

I would be more concerned about the buckwheat in TOPs because when I started adding it to my gloop (I am constantly playing around with the recipe, the newest addition is wild rice), my male sennie started plucking and I only made the connection later on when I stopped it (very high in oxalates) and he started allowing his feathers to grow. Now, I am not claiming I know for a fact that this was the reason why he started or that my eliminating it from the recipe was what made him stop but I always pay attention to 'coincidences' like this one and try to stay away from whatever it was that made me wonder.