The Missing Link?--diet

[Iggy's here]

In human nutrition we are beginning to realise the importance of probiotics (good bacteria that live in the gut). More and more studies are showing that people who have healthy diverse colonies of good bacteria in their systems get infections (colds, flue etc) a lot less frequently. When the 'bad' bacteria are allowed to thrive our health is compromised. As the immune system is mainly situated in the gut it makes sense.

There are three ways to ensure that healthy gut bacteria are encouraged. 1) by eating foods that nourish good bacteria (vegies, leafy greens etc) 2) By reducing foods that nourish the bad bacteria (sugars, starches) and 3) by including foods that contain probiotics (fermented foods).

Every culture on Earth has a tradition of eating fermented foods. Only in the last century did we abandon these practices as food began being prepared in factories and the fermentation process became inconvenient.

I also learned that most animals in nature have a means of attaining fermented foods. I know that here in Australia we often see Parrots eating over-ripe fermented fruits from trees (they end up a bit drunk)...and I have been wondering if this is a way they get their probiotics.

I am not suggesting we get our parrots drunk lol. But I think that ensuring they have access to probiotic food might be very beneficial to their health. I know birds are lactose intolerant, but I have seen many parrot food lists that include yoghurt. Yoghurt is a probiotic and contains many good bacteria. I believe that likely parrots, like many people, can tolerate it because the bacteria have broken down the lactose and make it much more digestible.

We make Kefir (an even healthier style of yoghurt...with more good bacteria) in our house and I am thinking of giving some to Iggy.

As Iggy is only a baby (who was weened on seeds) we are still working to develop his tastes. But I hope that as diet expands I will be able to introduce fermented cabbage and carrots etc.

I am interested to hear others thoughts on this.

[GreenWing]

Yogurt is a great way to introduce probiotics and I'm not sure about kefir as I have not looked into feeding it to my bird myself, but I think others would be able to weigh in on that one.

Garlic, however, is something I wonder about. For humans, garlic has been proven to fight and prevent microbial infections (including bacterial). I am curious about whether parrots CAN have garlic (cooked?), and if so, how much? Obviously to many it is considered a no-no but I have heard of "some" parrot owners giving their parrots very small amounts of it once in a blue moon. I'd be interested in more info regarding this, personally.

[Iggy's here]

Hmmm Garlic is an interesting one. For humans there are many proven benefits, but then there are some who say even for humans it is poisonous to some degree. I read some who say it is great for fish...and others who say it is toxic to them. Seems like the same with birds.

I wonder if anyone knows if a little salt is ok for parrots because we hope to give Iggy some of our dinners when it is appropriate, but unsure if it ok for him to have a bit of salt.

[GreenWing]

Hmmm Garlic is an interesting one. For humans there are many proven benefits, but then there are some who say even for humans it is poisonous to some degree. I read some who say it is great for fish...and others who say it is toxic to them. Seems like the same with birds.

Yes, very good point, this is why I want more info... I think I'm going to consult my Avian vet. But, flipping through Google and websites in the meanwhile, there's some interesting talk regarding it...

I wonder if anyone knows if a little salt is ok for parrots because we hope to give Iggy some of our dinners when it is appropriate, but unsure if it ok for him to have a bit of salt.

My say is a no-no to the salt addition. Salt is bad for parrots because, but simply, they they can't excrete salt the way humans can. When I cook, for example -- part of my Grey's dinner last night -- I lightly grilled grated organic carrots in a little organic coconut oil in an iron skillet, then I mixed the lightly grilled carrots with toasted birdie bread, and added fresh veggies to the mix.

Point being, I'd remove any food you're cooking for your bird from the iron skillet before adding your own stuff that you want to season with salt and eat yourself (like butter and salt seasonings).

[Pajarita]

My parrots get a bit of fresh, finely chopped garlic every 7 to 10 days and they have been getting it for the last 20 years + without a single problem.

They get no milk products, period. Birds are not mammals and have no enzymes to break down lacteous products so they get no real benefit from eating them (and some get loose stools and even bloating and diarrhea from them). The probiotics found in yogurt are very good for mammals but I don't think they are really that usable for parrots (see this: http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2012/0 ... iotics-101 - this: http://www.livestrong.com/article/41277 ... ic-yogurt/ - and this: http://www.docstoc.com/docs/104887923/M ... -(microbes)

The reason for this is that the beneficial bacteria found in yogurt simply converts the sugar in milk into lactic acid but parrots are herbivores and consume no lactic acid so I am not sure it does them any good.

Now, what parrots benefit from are cellulases and xynalases which are enzymes that break down plant material but I think that a good fresh food organic diet is more than sufficient to provide them with the natural enzymes (and that's another reason why I don't feed pellets). Having said that, I do give mine probiotics (as well as vit B12) every now and then but I use the human ones that have the greatest number of strains.

As to salt, parrots do not need any added salt. The sodium found in food (like celery, Swiss chard, artichokes, etc) is more than enough for their needs.

[GreenWing]

My parrots get a bit of fresh, finely chopped garlic every 7 to 10 days and they have been getting it for the last 20 years + without a single problem.

SO GLAD to get this info, so thanks, Pajarita. Especially since parrots are susceptible to aspergillosis, in studies I've seen on the Internet (haven't found scholarly articles yet but I have seen quick mentions via Google Internet search) I am delighted about this.

Pajarita, do you ever cook the garlic, or do you give it raw? And would cooking it be okay, as well?

They get no milk products, period. Birds are not mammals and have no enzymes to break down lacteous products so they get no real benefit from eating them (and some get loose stools and even bloating and diarrhea from them). The probiotics found in yogurt are very good for mammals but I don't think they are really that usable for parrots (see this: http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2012/0 ... iotics-101 - this: http://www.livestrong.com/article/41277 ... ic-yogurt/ - and this: http://www.docstoc.com/docs/104887923/M ... -(microbes)

Good to know. I was told a TINY bit of yogurt is okay... I have yet to give any to Chance, but I did give it to my Senegal in very small amounts once in a while.

Medium cheddar, as I've read on this website, has 95 percent less lactose and is acceptable though... but also in small amounts?

The sodium found in food (like celery, Swiss chard, artichokes, etc) is more than enough for their needs.

I love this info. Thank you. I've given celery to Chance... I've read it's not the best veggie to give, but Swiss Chard and artichokes... awesome! Man, I can't WAIT for gardening season, when all of my veggies will be ready for Chance's consumption!

[Pajarita]

I've never cooked the garlic for them (I try to give them as much raw as I can) but I would assume it would be OK. Cheddar has a lot of salt so be careful with it.

[treebird]

Hmm, yoghurt does seem to be a curious contradiction to the dairy-free nature of birds-- I've always found this interesting. This is a good question. I agree, I probably wouldn't immediately begin introducing fungi to my parrot's diet. However, the hummus idea struck me as a pretty good one. Sort of a middle ground to move in that direction it seems. Interesting concept!

[KimberlyAnn]

Now, what parrots benefit from are cellulases and xynalases which are enzymes that break down plant material but I think that a good fresh food organic diet is more than sufficient to provide them with the natural enzymes (and that's another reason why I don't feed pellets). Having said that, I do give mine probiotics (as well as vit B12) every now and then but I use the human ones that have the greatest number of strains.

In what form do you give the vitamin B12 and probiotics? Crushed up pills, liquid?

[Iggy's here]

I think that the reason that yoghurt is recommended in small amounts is that the enzymes produced by the bacteria in yoghurt predigest the product making it much easier to digest and make the vitamins much more available. This is even more true with kefir --and is why people who are lactose intolerant can consume kefir and reap the benefits without the digestive issues.

I am sure that in nature birds would have fermented foods in their diet and thus have a means to replenish their inner bacteria colonies. It seems to be a real key to health.

However, in nature they obviously would not be eating dairy. Store bought probiotics are one way to introduce good bacteria to their systems, but as my husband is writing a book on fermenting and probiotics I might get him to explore this further.

Great to read all the replies