Toggsy wrote:Pajarita wrote:Well, then I suggest you do a bit more in-depth research about parrots natural diets.
I find that comment quite offensive as was your comment in my intro thread bearing in mind you've not seen my aviary set up, how can you assume what knowledge I do or don't have in regards to care of my birds you've never met me personally.
So I ask You why do you feel the need to shoot me down along with others (ive read other post on other threads)
I've only been on the forum a short while and you've shot me down on more than one occasion hardly a warm welcome is it I'm now very aprahensive about posting or replying to future threads
Sorry for disrupting the thread but it's been bugging me and it had to be said
I am sorry you were offended but, in all honesty, if you feed quail eggs to your birds regularly, as you posted, you are feeding them something that is not good for them because it's not part of their natural diet (thus the reference to doing more research on the subject). People usually think that animals are herbivores, carnivores or omnivores but there are, actually, more categories within those three. In broad terms, you have 'generalist' and 'specialized' but even within those, there are still subcategories, depending on the range of foods the animal eats. Omnivores are all generalists because they eat a wide range of foods but there are herbivores that are also considered generalists within the herbivore classification because they eat a large variety of plants while, on the other hand, you have specialized herbivores like the koala which eats ONLY eucalyptus leaves. Animals that eat only one kind of food, be it a plant or an animal species are called monophagous, but you also have oligophagous (a small range) and polyphagous (a large range). Same thing with the carnivores, they can be generalists and eat all kinds of different animals or specialized - and then they can be obligate, meaning they cannot digest anything but meat, or non-obligate. When you talk about parrots, with the exception of one or two species, they are all considered herbivores when it comes to classification - and, if you want to be more specific, they are generalist herbivores because they consume a large range of different plant material (leaves, buds, flowers -with the pollen and the nectar, fruits, seeds, nuts, shoots, grains, etc). The herbivore classification is not only because of what they have been observed eating by ornithologists and biologists in the wild but because their physiology, in general, and, in particular, their digestive system evolved to process plant material. From the beak shape to the length of the intestines to the mechanisms the body has for absorbing nutrients and getting rid of what is not good for them, to the actual specific composition of these nutrients, etc. Eggs are animal protein. They have high protein, high fat and quite a bit of bad cholesterol. Parrot diets, in the wild, don't really have any significant amount of bad cholesterol so they did not evolved with a mechanism to get rid of the excess they might intake as, for example, we, humans, have. They might consume insects but they are a VERY small percentage of their entire diet and, on top of that, insect protein has a different composition of amino acids from what we would call meat (chicken, beef, pork, etc) and practically no fat to speak of. To put the icing on the cake, the high protein content of eggs is really not recommended for captive birds for the simple reason that we all feed our pet birds too much protein to begin with (pellets, seeds, nuts, nutriberries, avicakes) and a bird that doesn't have to fly miles and miles every day foraging doesn't need the same amount of protein that a wild bird would. Do they like eggs? Yes, they do. Why? Because of the high protein and high fat in them. Herbivores need to consume a much larger amount of food than carnivores do precisely because of the lack of abundant sources of high protein in plants. And, because protein and fat are necessary for life and essential for breeding, they are 'programmed' by nature to crave it and, when they find it, to gorge on it. But if they eat high protein and high fat regularly they end up with medical problems because their bodies cannot handle that kind of diet. And that's why you have so many pet parrots with fatty liver, high uric acid, high cholesterol, cholesterol deposits in the eyes, xanthomas, cardio-vascular conditions, etc. and why, although everybody is always saying that this species lives to be 40, 60, 80 years, we never hear of any pet bird living that long.
Now, could I have explained all this instead of just recommending you do more research? Yes, I could have. But, to put it simply, I really don't have the time for it and, even if I did, I still might not do it because I think that it's much better when people do their own research. And this is not only because information is better absorbed and understood this way but because in the process of researching one thing, one ends up learning lots of other things that might end up been just as important (and I'll give you a teaser: the relationship between herbivores diet and the production of vit B12 and why bird never need it as a supplement).
When it comes to bird husbandry, nobody should take anybody's word for anything, one should always do research and reach conclusions of their own (and, by research, I mean going to reputable sources, specifically, scientific sources) because there is too many people out there giving their own opinion on things, sometimes just repeating something they read or heard without actually checking the information to see if it's actually correct or if it has been updated - and lots and lots of things we thought were right were not! Thankfully, we are finding out new things all the time! So, I always tell people to do their own research, it wasn't you, personally, that I told to do it. And it's not to offend them, it's to point them in the right direction.
I might not be the most diplomatic person in the world but I do love birds and their wellbeing is always my first priority so, if you read my postings within that frame of mind, you will see that the information I give and the recommendations I make are always meant to benefit birds.
