diet frustration!

[DanaandPod]

Oh please! Revisiting this site, I see the same experienced people speaking of making pizza flavored parrot chop to that of technical scientific and biological references. Meanwhile, there's a hundred views but nobody comments. Today, someone referenced a biologist whom I checked out on Facebook...and though I learned coconut oil and other herbs preserve and are anti bacterial to add to left out food for those who work away from home...I'm seeing the exact same thing! Tons of people complaining that their parrot, just like mine won't eat this or that or most of these raw foods. So, I am thinking I'm not going down the worried road again as if I'm a bad parrot keeper and start blazing my kitchen with failed and expensive attempts at gloop. I mean I'll keep trying things to see if he likes them...but side with pellets as the staple with what he does eat. Plus, I don't see specific amounts listed for specific bird types so it is confusing. Often even seems contradicting. For instance, a few on here claim my two almonds and three pine nuts plus pellets per day is too much protein yet I read from the experienced ones that they give only seeds and nuts every night for dinner. I'm not planning to be a biologist either. I wish these sites would stop contradicting the parrot wizard book. Or making everything over the top complicated. A survey of what type of parrot owners are on here is needed. Because I'm guessing most are not zoologists but average and often inexperienced people with lives. Even though this revisit of the forum looks to be less negativity as of late... Somehow the dominating attitude is that owners are in the wrong. Very wrong. Sucks when you are some9ne reading who tries harder than many or who cares a lot. Hopefully, I'll gain better insight by live volunteer experiences soon such as with wildlife organizations in my state. What it boils down to is no matter the expert, can't force a bird to eat it. Ugh!

[Wolf]

Dana, I suspect that you are referring to me with saying that two almonds and three pine nuts may be too much protein and then saying that I feed my birds a seed mix with nuts for dinner.
I have one bird of about the same size as your Pod and that is Kiki a Senegal She is fed gloop and fresh produce in the morning and for all day nibbling on and then she is fed two nuts along with her seed mix for dinner. Sometimes she gets an extra piece of fruit or carrot for a treat during the day but not usually and she is not hormonal. With pod you were feeding him the nuts and pellets all day long plus he was acting hormonal which is why I said that the level of protein may have been too high.
Still you are right and most of us are just people like you and are not zoologists, biologists or whatever, We have consistently said that and I know that I am constantly telling people that there are no experts anywhere when it comes to parrots, we simply do not yet know enough about them. What we try to share are our experiences with the birds that we have and the results of the research that we read from the scientific papers that we find. Some of the information that we use is based on things that were found to be true in humans as there has been no research regarding parrots in many of these areas. We are truly just at the beginning of the long journey to learn about these wonderful and amazing birds. Everything that we offer should be taken as a suggestion only and you should add your own research to the suggestions that we make so that you make up your own mind about what to do. Are you going to make mistakes? yes, I know that I do, despite my best efforts.
As far as getting them to eat the foods that we want them to eat, they must be taught what is food and to eat it and although most of us have missed the window in their life cycles where they are the most receptive to this type of learning we still try to teach them in the same manner that their parents would have taught them and that is by eating the foods ourselves in front of them and then sharing the food with them as this is they way that they learn.
Look at the information that you learn from all of the different sources and then decide what you think is the best way to proceed, that is the part that we can't do for you. Take your time and you will be fine, that is one of the hardest parts is that we want to see results right away but it all takes time, so be patient with both yourself and with your birds. You are doing fine. If you are like most of us you will always be trying to improve things for your feathered friends.

[Pajarita]

It's not a matter of forcing a parrot to eat anything, it's a matter of persisting and trying different approaches until he does. One bird I had took 5 years to try a blueberry -something that all birds love! Gloop is actually fairly easy to transition them to because the whole grains look and feel like seeds to them but timing and presentation also play a part in it. You will have more luck starting with an al dente grains only served warm on a paper plate at the bottom of the cage early in the morning after you took his high protein dinner the previous night than with a 'final version' of it which has 50% veggies put in a bowl in the afternoon after he has been eating high protein since the am. There are recipes with specific amounts as well as general guidelines and, when it comes to portions, there is no need to give any because you can feed as much as you want and the bird will not gain weight on it.

Wolf is right, nobody here has claimed to be a field biologist studying parrots. The only thing we can do is give pointers and tell other people what we have learned and what we do with our birds. People should take that information and look up what the natural diet of these birds is and try to reproduce it as best as possible because Nature always knows best. People should also take into consideration that the premise that birds KNOW instinctually what to eat is bunk. Not even people know what to eat instinctually... if this was true, there would be no obesity, no high cholesterol, no high blood pressure from too much salt, no addictions to drugs, etc.

I am sorry you feel so negatively about this site and the information we give you but, if you have better information than what we have, we would appreciate your sharing it with us. I am also sorry that you haven't been able to get your parrot to eat as healthily as you wish but all we can do is give you recommendations on how to do it based on what has worked for us, we can't do it for you.

[DanaandPod]

The one thing that has been said that finally makes sense is that I missed out on the development of this parrot that has been revoked several times before me. I do eat the food in front of him. Today we tried shredded raw sweet potato. I liked it. He didn't. Its now on a plate on the bottom of the budgies cage along with their untouched romain. I really suggest that there are more realistic statements in this forum about the process for getting parrots to eat what you recommend. Because there is a huge gap of difference from maybe where your birds are at, and the knowledge and research talk on here...to that of a rehomed parrot who's realistically set on his pellets and fruit and nuts. I just feel like whenever I want a specific and simple answer I get a complicated one instead. People should know what to really expect and that its not always easy to get their bird to eat something. I could be wrong, but I'm guessing there's way more viewers who are in the same boat as me or lower but aren't willing to say. A year ago I followed a gloop recipe on here, messed around...put stuff in ice trays to freeze. Made a mess of this place like a preschooler experimenting...and it all wound up in the only mouth that would take it, the garbage. I could always try to eat more veggies. Actually, I eat pretty healthy. But I think even though I or others will keep trying things...that there needs to be more talk of the norm and what people give their parrots to try and maintain their health such as pellets which are consistently discouraged from giving on here. This is where you guys will cite the research and talk about how pellets are bad. Soy. Sugar. Only use Tops Etc., but then how is someone supposed to go from pellets are bad but their parrot won't eat raw foods to knowing what they as owners should do? Today, I felt a bit nerved because this guy someone posted about who advocates for whole food diet only basically said pellets have zero nutritional value. I just hope there won't be a ton of readers who decide to give their parrots nuts and apples because that is the only thing they currently eat...and now they are being told that pellets have no nutritional value. Plus, we all know our veggies are depleted anyway which is why humans take vitamin supplements but that's a whole other argument. I do free feed my pellets right now but its not like he's all that interested in eating them all day long. I just like that he is able to have it when I'm not home. It doesn't spoil. Etc. But, who knows! Maybe another year from now he will be eating full blown chop morning and night... Who knows!

[JessiMuse]

I had a whole lot to say, but considering its not that different from what wolf and Paj said, I'm not really gonna bother. Instead, I'm gonna try and address your situation, as it sounds similar to mine.

From my experience, some species of birds take texture and consistency over taste. If your bird seems to like harder, dryer foods than softer foods, raw veggies might not work for now. You can try dehydrating some vegetables for him, which can be done quite easily, even without a dehydrator. Here's a link that gives a few methods: http://food-hacks.wonderhowto.com/how-t ... r-0161531/
When it comes to birds, it's often recommended to dehydrate your own foods since store-bought dehydrated foods often have chemicals that aren't good for birds.

I would also suggest breaking them up into small pieces once they've been dehydrated, preferably around the same size as the pellets. It could help in convincing him to eat it (some birds prefer to have their food broken up).

[liz]

I raised 2 kids 18 months apart. Rachel loves all vegetables and fruit. She sometimes goes 3 days without eating meat. My son won't touch vegetables and rarely eats fruit. He lives on meat and carbohydrates. They were both raised the same way.

Rambo and Myrtle run the same. Myrtle eats veg and fruit but rarely eats nuts and seed. Rambo tries to survive on the few nuts and seed I give him and will sometime eat a little fruit and veg.

Just like kids they are all different and need a lot of special help.

[marie83]

Realistically it took me literally years to get Harlie to even try anything fresh. Hell she wouldn't even touch soaked seed!

Only time you fail is when you stop trying. The last 2 years we had her she would eat almost anything I put in front of her - after a few goes anyway.

Don't stop trying

[JessiMuse]

I eventually got Lucy into trying softer foods by holding it in front of her and saying "do you want it?". I started asking her that when I first got her and was gaining her trust by giving her some of her favorite treats straight from my hand.

She eventually figured out that if I say "do you want it?", it means whatever in my hand is edible. That still doesn't always mean she'll eat it after the first bite, but it's at least better than her ignoring it completely. She prefers dry foods, but will eat raw vegetables and even softer foods to an extant. One of her favorites is carrots, probably because of how crunchy it is.

[Pajarita]

The one thing that has been said that finally makes sense is that I missed out on the development of this parrot that has been revoked several times before me. I do eat the food in front of him. Today we tried shredded raw sweet potato. I liked it. He didn't. Its now on a plate on the bottom of the budgies cage along with their untouched romain. I really suggest that there are more realistic statements in this forum about the process for getting parrots to eat what you recommend. Because there is a huge gap of difference from maybe where your birds are at, and the knowledge and research talk on here...to that of a rehomed parrot who's realistically set on his pellets and fruit and nuts. I just feel like whenever I want a specific and simple answer I get a complicated one instead. People should know what to really expect and that its not always easy to get their bird to eat something. I could be wrong, but I'm guessing there's way more viewers who are in the same boat as me or lower but aren't willing to say. A year ago I followed a gloop recipe on here, messed around...put stuff in ice trays to freeze. Made a mess of this place like a preschooler experimenting...and it all wound up in the only mouth that would take it, the garbage. I could always try to eat more veggies. Actually, I eat pretty healthy. But I think even though I or others will keep trying things...that there needs to be more talk of the norm and what people give their parrots to try and maintain their health such as pellets which are consistently discouraged from giving on here. This is where you guys will cite the research and talk about how pellets are bad. Soy. Sugar. Only use Tops Etc., but then how is someone supposed to go from pellets are bad but their parrot won't eat raw foods to knowing what they as owners should do? Today, I felt a bit nerved because this guy someone posted about who advocates for whole food diet only basically said pellets have zero nutritional value. I just hope there won't be a ton of readers who decide to give their parrots nuts and apples because that is the only thing they currently eat...and now they are being told that pellets have no nutritional value. Plus, we all know our veggies are depleted anyway which is why humans take vitamin supplements but that's a whole other argument. I do free feed my pellets right now but its not like he's all that interested in eating them all day long. I just like that he is able to have it when I'm not home. It doesn't spoil. Etc. But, who knows! Maybe another year from now he will be eating full blown chop morning and night... Who knows!

All my parrots came from somebody else's home, most were older and almost all of them were seed junkies so it's not as if I did not have to go through a transition with each of them. I did. You just have to keep on trying and experimenting with different approaches (presentation, cooked or not cooked, al dente or soft, sliced or cubed, etc) until you find the one that works for that particular food. All my parrots eat raw carrots but there is one gray that would only eat it if it's coarsely shredded, the GCC and peachfront would only eat it if I stick half a carrot between the bars while the rest eat it in chunks. I put chunks of baked sweet potatoes in the gloop but there are days that they will eat it and there are days that they will not but they will never eat raw ones. I know somebody who gives her birds raw pumpkin but none of mine would eat it that way although they would eat it nuked and thawed after frozen which is the same as raw but softer. You have to keep on trying and experimenting but, I might as well tell you that as long as you free-feed pellets, you are not going to get him to eat a large variety.

As to the nutritional level of veggies, yes, you are right, fresh is not really that good and that's why most of us use frozen in the gloop or chop. But we also give fresh because the enzymatic value of fresh is higher than that of frozen. There is no one food that does it all, it's in the variety that you find the answer.

And I doubt that there are that many people who been confused don't say anything about it because the ones that are ask questions and we answer - and, if they need further clarification, we keep on explaining until they understand what we mean.

[Wolf]

I do know that I have said repeatedly that switching our birds to a healthier diet is not easy and that you have to try different ways to even get them to taste it the first time. That you need to try chopped up from tiny pieces to large chunks, even shredded and whole and that with each of these you need to try raw, cooked and even just half cooked. But the only thing that will make it work is to never ever give up.
When I first started replying to other people on this forum, I did it because the only person who was doing it was Pajarita. She easily has 10 times the experience with birds than I do, but I though that people should have more people speaking and sharing the information that we have as one or two ways of saying something is not enough, people learn best when things are said in ways more familiar to them and I keep encouraging others to speak up and say what they think and share their experiences. I can't count the times that I have been corrected for not giving the best answer that I could have or the times that my sense of humor got in the way and I have had to apologise for insult that was unintended but I keep answering people question as best that I can.