Diet Conversion Journey

[beakycheekie]

I thought I would start this thread to discuss my experiences with transitioning my birds to a healthier diet. Hopefully I can get some advice and input (I've already gotten some great info from several of you, including Wolf and Pajarita, thank you!!) and I'm hoping it can also be useful to others starting a diet conversion process.
This is literally the very beginning of my process and I'm hoping to reach the end goal of having my birds enjoy a varied and fresh diet that is as close to be "natural" as one could hope to feed to captive wild species.
Most of my 7 birds have been adopted from shelters/rescues and so came from either unknown backgrounds (came in as "strays") or were fed strictly all seed diets by their previous owners. I have to admit that I am not good at being strict with my babies (my human one included!) and cave easily if I feel like someone is unhappy. I have this innate desire to please and make others happy and I really have to fight against it sometimes. I am telling you this because it makes me really anxious to think about doing a major diet conversion. I'm terrified of somebody going on a hunger strike and starving! So, up to the present I have been feeding my flock an all-seed mix because that is what they wanted. Some of my birds demand the CHEAPEST seed possible (you know, the kind in the big plastic jar from Walmart) and turn their noses up to anything else. Up until now I caved after them not eating new food immediately and would just replace it with the cheapo seed mix. BUT, I am determined to change their diet and I am going to start small and work my way up. The first thing I have done is to buy a good quality seed mix. I purchased TOPS Napolean's seed mixture (it's for small hookbills) and started feeding it yesterday. I still had some of the cheap seed mixture left and so I put some of the old stuff in one bowl and the new stuff in the second bowl in each of their cages. When I came home from work, all except 1 bird had ignored the new seed and had instead just finished up the old cheap seed. The 1 bird that ate the new seed absolutely devoured every tiny piece (this cockatiel Herman, is the only bird that has a cage to himself, the other guys are in multiple flight cages). When I come home from work tonight, if the new seed mixture has still been untouched for the remaining 6(and it's the only food available now, the cheap stuff is gone) do I stay strong and continue to offer that? I'm thinking yes, right? If I hope to get them eating healthier, I'm going to have to remain on track and not cave to their begging for the horrible Walmart junk food.
Anybody feel free to chime in with their stories, experiences, wisdom, concerns, etc!!!

[Wolf]

No, you do not remain strong, you go out and get another jar of the seed mix that they are accustomed to.
All major changes in diet need to be done slowly so as to not overly stress the birds.

I am familiar with and like the Napoleons all in one soak/ dry seed mix by TOPS, but I feel that it is also pretty limited especially in the area of variety. Budgies, if that is what you mean by the term parakeets, and cockatiels are both ground feeders and they eat a substantially larger proportion of seeds, particularly grass seeds than most other parrots and the Napoleons mix only has five different seeds in it.

The way that I would begin this process with is to mix the seed mix that they are used to with an equal amount of the Napoleons mix so that they will begin to eat the new mix, but it will not happen over night. I would remove all seed from the cage at night and then first thing in the morning tear off several leaves of leaf lettuce such as romaine and also shred up a little bit and sit with the birds before they receive any other food and start teaching them to eat this leaf lettuce ( never iceburg lettuce) by talking to them while nibbling on some of the lettuce while talking to them and then offering them small bites of the shredded lettuce. I would then place several whole leaves of the romaine in the bottom of the cage for them. I would cook some of the Napoleons mix until it is soft on the outside but still hard inside and place this on a bed of shredded lettuce on a plate in the bottom of the cage, after the Napoleons mix is cooled down to room temperature with no hot spots, and then add some of their usual seeds on top of this. I would give them enough to last until dinner time and then feed them the regular seeds mixed with the Napoleons mix for dinner. They will start eating these foods in a matter of days. The seed mix that they are accustomed to will keep them from getting overly hungry while the start eating the rest of these foods.

[beakycheekie]

Ok, thank you Wolf! This is the input that I need. I guess it shows that I've never done this before. I thought maybe I was starting small by just transitioning them onto another brand of seed mix and not something like pellets or fresh food so I didn't think it would be dramatic. But it does look and smell different from the cheap stuff they are used to, but in a good way! It seems so much more natural but I guess it seems foreign to them. I thought if I mixed it in with the old stuff they would just pick the old stuff out and then I'd be throwing away the expensive new stuff with the hulls of the old that had been eaten.
And I didn't mean that even though I've already gotten advice from Wolf and Pajarita that I didn't want you to keep contributing, on the contrary, please comment! You're so very helpful. Thank you!

[Wolf]

Yeah, I just can't keep my trap shut as I am very mouthy.

You might throw out some of the expensive stuff, but you can reduce that waste by blowing the empty hulls out of the good seed. This is probably best done with the dish of seed slowly poured into a paper plate while gently blowing on it or by pouring some onto the paper plate and blowing the hulls to one side and emptying the hulls into the compost or trash and saving the good seed. You would need to play with this a little so that you get the blowing part right, but the hulls are lighter than the good seed. You could also use water as the hulls will float quicker than the good seed and then sprout the seed that is left and add that to the morning feeding after rinsing it well.

[beakycheekie]

Oh gotcha, ok thanks! That'll help reduce some waste. The TOPS is quite expensive and while I want to spend the money to buy good food for my guys I can't stand the thought of throwing away uneaten food every day.

[Pajarita]

Well, personally, I would use the Napoleon dry for dinner until it's finished and make some gloop for their breakfast. My tiels and budgies all love gloop and it's a fabulous medium for making them eat veggies (which is not an easy thing to do with the little ones).

I would start by making an all grain gloop (kamut, barley -unhulled if you can find it but, if you can't, get the hulled one, not the pearled- oat groats and, if you can afford it, some quinoa) and mix it with the cheap seed (just a sprinkle of it, not a lot). Put it on the bottom of the cage (they are ground feeders so putting the food on the ground triggers an instinctual response in them) and leave it there all day long until dinner time when you take it away and replace it with the Napoleon for dinner but don't give them a lot, just enough for them to fill their crop (about a heaping tablespoon each tiel and a level one for the keets). After they are asleep, take away whatever is left over and, in the morning, give them the gloop with the seeds, again. Once you see they are eating the grains regularly (you will find empty white 'skins'), you can start adding other stuff gradually one at a time and always waiting until they are eating the new addition before putting something new. You can add lentils (make sure they are cooked well), small white beans (don't use anything but white beans ) and then start on the veggies - first sweet corn (they LOVE corn), then peas (they prefer the baby ones but will eat the regular size, too), cooked and diced carrots, chopped broccoli (make sure it's chopped and not in pieces or they will not eat it), cooked sweet potato (you can nuke them in a Potato Express bag and put them in bigger chunks). When you run out of Napoleon mix, you can buy a cheaper budgie mix -you can add a few striped sunflowers for the tiels- but make sure it's nothing but seeds (no dry corn or stuff made with soy). I have never been lucky in getting keets or tiels to eat fruit -of all of the ones I've had, only a couple actually ate them- but they both LOVE greens so if you can manage to give them a different one each day (escarole, chicory, celery, arugula, Swiss chard -they love the red one but don't give it to them more than once a week because it's pretty high in oxalic acid- all the cabbages, broccoli, broccoli-rabe, endive, carrot tops -not beet tops!- kale -but only the blue one and, again, not too often, etc), they would be eating a pretty good diet.

[beakycheekie]

This morning my elderly cockatiel had polished off his Napoleon's completely. The budgies were picking at it marginally but the two tiel girls had absolutely refused to touch it. I ended up mixing in some of the old seed mix with the new stuff.

Ok, great. Thank you Pajarita! That is some great info. I actually printed it out so that I could remember it all. How strict are you with the diet change progression? I know you used to have a rescue so I'm sure you got in birds all the time that were strays with unknown diet histories or that came from homes where they were fed cheap seed mixes. How did you get them eating such a good diet? What did you do if they refused the food?

[beakycheekie]

I'm waiting for Pajarita to answer my questions, but in the meantime I thought I would post what's going on today.
Like I said before, my elderly cockatiel LOVES the Napoleon's seed mix. He is eating better than I have ever seen him eat before, I can't believe it.
The budgies picked at the Napoleon's yesterday so I went out and bought some other seed to mix in, which is similar to what they were eating before but is better quality. Price per pound it's the same as the Napoleon's, it just came in a smaller quantity. Wolf said that budgies need a wider variety of seeds than what the Napoleon's is made with, so I got this seed from Living World that has more variety, to mix in with the Napoleon's.
Napoleon's is made with: Oat groats, millet, flax seeds, buckwheat and sesame seeds. The Living World seed mix that I'm mixing in has canary grass seed, white millet, red millet, Siberian millet, canola seed, flaxseed, hemp seed, niger seed and a few other ingredients that aren't seed, like dried fruit that I'm sure the budgies will just ignore. I plan on feeding this mixture as their daily evening meal (and eventually, HOPEFULLY someday they will eat gloop for breakfast but for now it will be all seed).
The other 2 cockatiels are refusing to eat the Napoleon's and are acting like it's inedible, which I know it isn't because my cockatiel Herman loves it!! There is no reason why they can't eat it, it's just going to take time so I bought their old seed mixture and am going to gradually mix in the Napoleon's and hopefully wean them off the old stuff slowly.

[liz]

So I am suppose to be feeding Napoleons? I remember being told not to use the Walmart brand but did not know what else to go to.
Where do I get it?

[beakycheekie]

Liz, I don't know that Napoleon's is super superior to other seed mixes, but I am planning on feeding it to my guys. I was looking for a seed mix that was natural, organic, free of artificial flavorings or colors. I am really happy with how fresh and natural the mix seems to be. It looks and smells TOTALLY different from the commercial seed mixes, like the kind you'd get a Walmart. So far my birds are not as impressed with it, but I think it's because it seems so foreign to them, it's so different from what they're used to. The one exception is my elderly cockatiel "Herman" who absolutely LOVES it. Honestly, I have never seen this bird eat so well, it makes me so happy. As for the other guys, I am mixing it with their old seed mix and will increase the ratio of Napoleon's as time goes by.
I bought it off Amazon and it was $25.00 for 5 lbs. Not cheap, especially with 7 birds all eating it but I really want them to eat healthy.
http://www.amazon.com/Napoleons-Seed-Mi ... n+seed+mix