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itchy senegal...

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itchy senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:38 am

Hi guys,

Just looking for some opinions, since early may my parrot (4 years old) has been very itchy, i started to notice both his ear holes through his feathers. He scratches in that region a lot, i once notice a little liquid bubble in both ear holes but not now.

He has bald patches on his face and he scratches in the corners by his beak. His beak has little marks on it.

I notice he does that beak open thing a hell of a lot, not gasping for air but like that thing they do to aid digestion i believe. He has little yellow dots on face, vet ruled out mites.

Feathers on his face sometimes come out easily when stroking him and my avian vet noted a small yellow deposit in his feather when he plucked one out to investigate, poo looks normal. No lethargy and activity levels normal, nose and skin around beak is puffy and flaky.

Hes currently on a 7 day course of baytril and metacam

He has to go back on the 18th to the vet for a culture and sensitivity test, i believe the vet said something about pathogens.

Does this sound something easy to fix or something more sinister?
stevesjk
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby liz » Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:16 am

When was the last time you gave him a bath or shower?
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liz
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:03 am

Hi liz, every day with a drop of aloe vera juice
stevesjk
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Gender: This parrot forum member is male
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:48 am

Does he eat soy based pellets? Because soy is a known allergen and, although nobody has ever proven that parrots actually have allergies, I would think that there is a distinct possibility of an animal not know for allergies to develop one [or a strong intolerance] when fed long time a known allergen that is not part of its [or any other animal, for that matter!] natural diet.

The baytril will take care of whatever bacteria is there and the Metacam will reduce the inflammation [both good things because even if this is not caused by bacteria, the inflammation indicates a process of the immune system which, in turn, can lead to secondary bacterial infections 'catching on'] but, if it's an allergy or an intolerance, it will come back so, if he is eating soy [and check the ingredients of everything he is now eating because soy is absolutely ubiquitous in commercial food products] and I were you, I would switch him to something healthier and make sure I keep exact track of everything he eats, just in case. I am not saying this is the case with your bird but a lot of people think that giving them stuff that is unnatural to them is OK as long as it's 'in moderation' which, needless to say, I do not agree with because a) moderation is a completely subjective term and b) because there is bad stuff that is still very bad even if consumed in small quantities.

Also, if you use tap water for his bath, have you had it checked lately? Because some places have water that is harder than others and some have way too many chemicals in them [like fluoride]. Of course, you can always go with spring water...
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:48 am

His main diet is fruit and veg but i do supplement with a few harrisons pellets.

Just come from the vets, hes been treated for mites just in case and told to persist with the metacam.

Still irritated after a week of baytril, apparently if the mites treatment doesnt work we are going into biopsy territory, bit unnerving because in my experience things can go downhill quick with birds when they start getting messed about.
stevesjk
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Gender: This parrot forum member is male
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:19 am

I agree with you 100%! Mind you, not that I would even consider not taking any of my animals to the vet if sick but, when it comes to birds, I rather exhaust every single natural remedy and treatment before I go into 'fishing expedition' tests. I also dislike giving them long term meds that are metabolized through the liver... As a matter of fact, I never do. I think that, in the long run, this does more harm than good. Try changing the diet to strictly no soy [actually, I would recommend you stop the pellets completely] and organic [so many chemicals in everything nowadays...], the drinking and bathing water to good bottled spring water and stop adding the aloe vera [not that I think it's bad but what the heck! I would change EVERYTHING just in case] and bathe him with a very weak chamomile and calendula tea [this is good for him to drink, also]. I would also stop the Metacam UNLESS I saw a big improvement with it [avian vets are trained on dogs and cats first and foremost and they love to prescribe the same meds to birds that they do to dogs, but dogs do well on them and birds don't]. You can always try a natural anti-inflammatory [like yucca intensive or passion fruit] and add some ginger, rosemary or turmeric [if he likes it, my birds don't] to his soft food. But be careful not to use more than the tiniest sprinkle!

One more thing: has he been having good molts? Meaning timely, normal, half the plumage molts with good new feathers coming out? Because you say that his diet is mainly produce and that you just 'supplement with a few pellets' which could mean a protein deficiency. African birds do require a bit more protein than South American ones and a protein deficiency does cause itchy skin and rashes... Why don't you try giving him nuts and a good seed mix for dinner -and add flax seeds to it because the omega 3 is essential for good skin.
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:39 am

Thanks pajarita I'll take everything you said on board.

Ive never noticed my bird molting in the years ive had him to be honest.

I dont fully trust the avian vet i currently got, everything i ask him he has to look up the answers in a book so im changing vets, he cant see any mites on him yet he's treating him for them, he told me sometimes they can be microscopic and when i said he doesnt interact with any other birds he said he could have contracted them from the nest but hes over 4 and a half years old.

From what ive read the only mites that can make a bird itch are red mites and they are easily visable.
stevesjk
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Gender: This parrot forum member is male
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Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
Flight: Yes

Re: itchy senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:59 am

Well, there is also bird lice -which are a type of mite, too. And none of them are actually microscopic - they are super duper tiny and you do need good eyes and, sometimes, a contrasting background [for example, you would use a white paper to clearly see the tiny dark dots on it] but they can all be seen without a microscope. But what are the chances of the bird having mites after over 4 years without a single symptom? None if you ask me! And I am with you in the why medicate with poison [because that is what the medicine for mites is, after all] when there is zero chance of the bird having mites?


Now, the fact that you have never seen your bird molt is very troublesome because it means there is something very wrong there. But is it possible that he has molted and you did not noticed? Senegals molt once a year like clockwork and the lack of a full molt means either a soft molt [when they molt all the time but, usually, only the contour feathers] or no molt at all. The soft molt [not to be confused with French molt] means that the bird is eating too much protein -and I am sure your bird doesn't have it because, if he did, you would see pins on him ALL THE TIME. Are his primaries in good shape? Because in both soft molt or lack of molt the primaries end up looking all raggedy - and I do mean BAD raggedy [I will ask my husband to take a picture of Javi Caique's open wings to show you] with practically just the shaft and no barbs, barbules, barbicels or nothing. No molt means either that the bird is not metabolizing protein due to advanced liver malfunction [I do not think this is the case with your bird but did the vet do a bile acid test?], a genetic defect [in which case you would see no down feathers at all] or not enough protein in his diet. Is its possible that, in your desire not to overfeed protein, he ended up not getting enough of it to produce new feathers? Because sennies need more than just a few pellets...

I would not trust a vet that needs to go check a book every time I ask a question, either...
Pajarita
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:36 am

Ive got brilliant eyesight, never seen anything on him and the vet had a light and magnifying glass looking at him and he saw nothing either so i doubt hes got mites.

Regards the molt, its possible its happened without me noticing but he's definitely never been excessively itchy in the past until now. Sometimes when i rub the back of his head there can be one or two pin feathers there that just stay there for ages, almost like a molt frozen in time so i cannot rule out a soft molt. His primaries are fine. No mention ever of an acid bile test but ive got an appointment in two weeks with a much better avian vet so ill bring it up. There was mention of little yellow deposits on the base of the feathers, he pulled one out and showed me.

I dont think ive underfed protein but i couldnt put my life on it and say i havent.

Could this be serious?
stevesjk
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Gender: This parrot forum member is male
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Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
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Re: itchy senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:22 am

Can it be serious? I don't know because we don't know what is causing it. Now, my male senegal plucks and he looks as if he was very itchy when doing it because half the time, it looks as if he was scratching himself in earnest but he is not, it's just his way of plucking. Is it possible that this is what is happening to yours?
Pajarita
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Gender: This parrot forum member is female
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