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Itchy Senegal...

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Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Wed Mar 23, 2022 5:45 pm

Apparently this treatment is so harsh it can actually kill the bird
stevesjk
Conure
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 220
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:44 am

I don't know of any bird that died from the therapy and there is no mention of this possibility in any of the writings about it.

What is the name of the pill the London vet recommended?

In am emergency, Aanybody can give a IM shot to an animal. All you have to do is towel her properly - you not only use the towel to hold her but you also hold the back of her neck gently and without squeezing, of course and Bob's your uncle! Basically what you do is put an open kitchen towel on your hand, grab the bird from the back with it and, with you kind of 'wrap' your thumb and index finger around her neck. This impedes the bird from moving but leaves the chest exposed for the shot.
Pajarita
Norwegian Blue
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 18559
Location: NW Pa
Number of Birds Owned: 30
Types of Birds Owned: RoseBreasted too, CAG, DoubleYellowHead Amazon, BlueFront Amazon, YellowNape Amazon, Senegal, African Redbelly, Quaker, Sun Conure, Nanday, BlackCap Caique, WhiteBelly Caique, PeachFace lovebird, budgies,
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Thu Mar 24, 2022 12:23 pm

DMSA oral tablets apparently they are tiny and a top avian vet has told me if they don't work then the shots won't work either.

The vet has only pitched this idea to me as something that might work and not something that will work. I wonder why he's done that?.

He's also warned me that it may kill my bird.

Apparently it is a treatment not to be taken lightly and especially the skittish ones, not only are they Ill, they have the stress of being caught, taken for vet trips for more injections and all the stress that comes with it
stevesjk
Conure
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 220
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Fri Mar 25, 2022 9:43 am

Well, the DMA is the oral part of the therapy but, as far as I know, it's never given by itself, although I assume you can... it's just that I don't think just the oral med will be effective by itself. But I think that there is a misunderstanding as to the effectiveness of the therapy. Both the shots and the oral med ARE effective, they ALWAYS work but, if the bird is too far gone, it will die from the poisoning even though the therapy works. Again, think of cancer and chemo, it they find the cancer early, the patient can be 'cured' with it but, if the cancer has metastasized and it has spread all over the place, it won't. But, again, it's not that the treatment doesn't work, it's that it was too little, too late. Time is of the essence on these things.

And, again, yes, the therapy is very stressful to the bird but the only other option is sure death. Personally, I would go with a stressed out bird that ends up alive than a dead one... and it's not as if the bird is not stressed now because disease/pain always stresses them out.
Pajarita
Norwegian Blue
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 18559
Location: NW Pa
Number of Birds Owned: 30
Types of Birds Owned: RoseBreasted too, CAG, DoubleYellowHead Amazon, BlueFront Amazon, YellowNape Amazon, Senegal, African Redbelly, Quaker, Sun Conure, Nanday, BlackCap Caique, WhiteBelly Caique, PeachFace lovebird, budgies,
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:08 pm

Thanks pajarita for the speedy response as always.

I had a chat with the vet earlier, it wasn't too positive to be honest. He was saying that the liver is struggling, the procedure is very painful and as the zinc has been in the system for so long there's probably organ damage. He said I'll probably find that the bird will be highly stressed by the 2nd or 3rd vet visit because it knows what's coming and might possibly give it a heart attack.

The vet was saying he can try it if I want but I felt like he was pushing me towards putting her to sleep because of what she's been through
stevesjk
Conure
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 220
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Sat Mar 26, 2022 9:30 am

Well, that's a decision you would have to make all by yourself. Personally, I put all my animals down humanely once there is nothing more to do and they are suffering in any way but, if they are suffering and there is still the smallest hope with a treatment, I do the treatment. It's a very difficult decision to make because we don't really know how the animal is feeling.
Pajarita
Norwegian Blue
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 18559
Location: NW Pa
Number of Birds Owned: 30
Types of Birds Owned: RoseBreasted too, CAG, DoubleYellowHead Amazon, BlueFront Amazon, YellowNape Amazon, Senegal, African Redbelly, Quaker, Sun Conure, Nanday, BlackCap Caique, WhiteBelly Caique, PeachFace lovebird, budgies,
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Sat Mar 26, 2022 12:47 pm

Thank you pajarita, your dedication to the birds is unwavering.

I'm going to do what I think is best for the bird based on the birds temperament and what I think she can and cannot tolerate. Also the fact that the vet has stressed that she's probably got organ problems, definitely liver problems according to the tests
stevesjk
Conure
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 220
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Sat Mar 26, 2022 12:50 pm

Oh, also the vet said the cure itself is likely to cause liver or kidney failure
stevesjk
Conure
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 220
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby Pajarita » Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:20 am

Well, the vet should be able to tell whether the organs are already damaged or not from the blood work...
Pajarita
Norwegian Blue
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is female
Posts: 18559
Location: NW Pa
Number of Birds Owned: 30
Types of Birds Owned: RoseBreasted too, CAG, DoubleYellowHead Amazon, BlueFront Amazon, YellowNape Amazon, Senegal, African Redbelly, Quaker, Sun Conure, Nanday, BlackCap Caique, WhiteBelly Caique, PeachFace lovebird, budgies,
Flight: Yes

Re: Itchy Senegal...

Postby stevesjk » Sun Mar 27, 2022 7:11 pm

I'll ask all this when I take her in, he did mention she has a liver condition from it.

I'll be totally honest, even if the vet gave me 100% success rate I'd still be unsure about injecting a small bird over 10 times in 12 days. He warned me that this treatment is highly stressful especially for a phobic bird.

One or two injections I could handle but I would insist on anaesthetic even if that put her in danger of dying because I place keeping her free from any physical trauma ahead of death itself if that makes sense. Maybe that makes me a bad person I don't know.

I have spent every single day in the last 8 years with this bird, believe me when I say I'm devastated
stevesjk
Conure
 
Gender: This parrot forum member is male
Posts: 220
Number of Birds Owned: 2
Types of Birds Owned: Senegal parrot budgie
Flight: Yes

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