Not again :(

[marie83]

Rightio, I believe I already read that article but then I've already read over 10 articles on it so hard to be sure. My understanding of it was the faeces had to be less than 10 minutes old to see any movements under the microscope from the parasite but that it could be tested using other methods. I think maybe I've misunderstood though so I wont bother taking a faeces sample and wait to see what the vet suggests. Chances are both my two will "go" whilst we are there anyway so that will be one sample sorted then I can post the other two samples off if needed cuz I imagine the vet will provide the preservative if needed given the length of time I would need to drive to take them there.

Glad yours didn't have it as it sounds like its a pain in the *** to treat, hopefully mine wont either but I do believe there is some sort of medical reason for this rather than a psychological issue...its just getting the vet to know that too. The last vet was convinced it was a bacterial infection which the baytril sorted or a behavioural issue. I guess you get to the point in just wanting to know whats wrong, sometimes no news isn't good news, especially when it comes to how we worry about our "babies"

[Andromeda]

My understanding of it was the faeces had to be less than 10 minutes old to see any movements under the microscope from the parasite but that it could be tested using other methods. I think maybe I've misunderstood though so I wont bother taking a faeces sample and wait to see what the vet suggests.

I'm also a little unclear on the actual testing methods but I do know that the parasite is extremely hard to preserve. I'm sure the vet will be able to explain in more detail.

Chances are both my two will "go" whilst we are there anyway so that will be one sample sorted then I can post the other two samples off if needed cuz I imagine the vet will provide the preservative if needed given the length of time I would need to drive to take them there.

Now that is an excellent idea. If you can get the vet to give you some formalin you could just take it home and then preserve some extra samples at home for future testing. It might be worth asking the vet whether they use a 10% or 5% solution because 10% is the standard. The discovery that the diagnostic rate for giardia in birds is far more accurate with a 5% formalin solution is a very recent one. Giardia is so fragile.

Glad yours didn't have it as it sounds like its a pain in the *** to treat, hopefully mine wont either but I do believe there is some sort of medical reason for this rather than a psychological issue...its just getting the vet to know that too. The last vet was convinced it was a bacterial infection which the baytril sorted or a behavioural issue. I guess you get to the point in just wanting to know whats wrong, sometimes no news isn't good news, especially when it comes to how we worry about our "babies"

Yes, I'm with you 100% about how sometimes no news isn't good news. I am really glad he didn't have giardia but at the same time I was hoping to find a medical reason behind the plucking. He's been tested for everything at this point so it seems that it's psychological. I started clicker training with him in mid-February and the plucking immediately and drastically reduced in severity. Now he only plucks his legs (as opposed to his legs as well as under his wings, around his vent, between his legs, and up his chest). I'm in the process of re-fledging him in the hopes that he will stop completely, but who knows what's going on in that brain of his.

Hopefully little Ollie doesn't have giardia; that being said from what you've described it does seem like it might be a medical issue so if it's not giardia who knows what's happening with the poor guy. Best of luck with your new vet. I hope that he or she has some new ideas about how to approach the situation. I know how it is to worry about your babies and it's so hard to find out what wrong with them since they can't tell us with words.

[marie83]

Not long since back from the vets with Ollie, the vet saw no need to see Harlie as well at this point because of her nervousness but has given me a pot for fecel samples at a later date.
He doesn't think Ollie has external parasites but has given him a bit of spot on for them just in case. The vet also doesn't think that giardia is likely but will test for it once he has seen specifically what Ollie has already been tested for.
The vet said he wants to go over the bloodwork and xrays Ollie had done last year before he suggests any further action. Now we are just waiting til next week for him to ring to see what the next step is.

[marie83]

Finally heard back from the vets, he has gone over the work we had done last year and agrees with the first vet that there are no abnormalties in the test done. We have another appointment booked for next week, I'm to get 3 days faecel samples the days before and he wants to pluck approximately 3 feathers from under Ollies wing. Anyone any idea what the feathers are for? I didn't get chance to ask.

[liz]

I guess it would be like checking hair for toxins. They can test hair and even tell what month you contacted something.

[marie83]

Just been to the vets with Ollie again and there's a few more feathers missing under his wings which he has pulled today because it wasn't like that yesterday. This time his right wing is worse than his left one but it was the other way round last time he was sick.

I also noticed yesterday that Harlies poop had a foamy appearence but this mornings poop was fine if slightly looser than normal and mentioned that. The vets quite concerned about that and is hoping the faeces samples will show what the problem is. Hopefully we shall have the results by next Tuesday.

The vet plucked a few feathers from under Ollies wing and he was as good as gold, didn't try to bite or anything but did scream of course. He examined them under the microscope and can't find anything wrong but did say there is no sign of any chewing or Ollie messing about with them, he is basicly just whipping them straight out.

Other than that both birds are very much themselves which I suppose is a good thing. The vets pretty baffled though and called my two an unusual case but at least he is taking things more seriously than my other vet. Another waiting game now to see what the next move is.

[marie83]

We've had most of the faeces sample test results back now, the vet rang last night, we are still waiting for 2 more results to come back which will hopefully be today or tomorrow. Everything seems normal so far and theres no sign of giardia which is good news.

[marie83]

Finally had the rest of the faeceal results back and everything has come back clear. The vets did have them sooner but we've had communication issues, pretty much every time he rang to update me I've been at the hospital.

The past few days Ollie appears to be leaving his feathers alone as his wing pits don't look any worse. I've not heard either bird scream when preening but to be fair I haven't been around as much so it could still be going on, I've been at home and handling them in lots of short bursts rather than a couple of longer ones or one long session. I've not noticed any more bubbly poop but I guess the bubbles could be popping before I see it.

The vets suggested either:
-leaving further testing for now and seeing how they go
- doing more tests on the feathers which will be expensive
- trying an implant to regulate hormone levels
- putting them on prozac

The vet doesn't really want to do the last two ideas until he knows what he is treating them for and tbh I dont want to go those roads either apart from as a very very last resort.
The vet is ringing me again on Monday so we can organise another appointment to discuss the options and what they involve.

As it stands at the moment I'm only willing to go with monitoring them a bit longer or further feather work. Not really sure which to do but I guess that the next appointment will help me make up my mind.

[marie83]

I'm not really sure if anyones following this story but so far I have no further information.

The vets given me an assessment questionairre to determine the probability of it being a medical/nutritional/behaviour problem as he doesn't want to put Ollie through more tests unless he has to.
The questionaire itself is very long and goes into alot of detail. It covers everything from how many homes the bird has had, how he reacts to me, partner and strangers in specific circumstances, what he eats and how much, to drawing a map of the house to see where his cage is located and how often he is out of his cage. It would take me all day to list all the questions, I think the only thing it doesn't cover is training and what there is for the bird to do when not in his cage, the vet asked for my feedback on the questionaire- apparently a few of his clients he gave it to never filled it in, so I'll mention that there should be a section on training lol.
Anyway instead of drawing the requested things like cage design, view from the cage and maps I've decided to enclose photo's when I post it back as I believe they will be more helpful (I'm lousy at drawing anyway).

[cml]

I am following it, and I hope for the best!