marie83 wrote:Pajarita wrote:My problem with socializing them when they are babies/juveniles is that it never happens in nature and we have absolutely no long-term proof that it's beneficial for them (my two main criteria for recommending anything). It's just an unproven theory still at this point in time and, although it sounds right to us, this might very well be because it's the way we raise our children and other pet mammals (dogs, cats, etc) so, as far as I am concerned, I will continue doing what has worked for me for many years and leave the experimenting to others. But, if down the road, say, 10 or 15 years from now, the parrots that were socialized when still not adults are all doing fine (no signs of undue stress in any way), then I will definitely recommend it but only for certain species.
Bolded bit in my opinion is rubbish, as soon as they are poking their heads out the nest they are constantly exposed to new things. It's all about how you go about it IMO. Ok I cant speak for larger species but Harlie has been my only un-socialized bird or in fact not just bird, any species I've had and she really cannot handle anything new. All others fine, not scared of much at all, I could swap their cages/toys around no problem, put them in carriers, introduce novel people, noises etc. all fine. She did have an abusive past though so I haven't been able to work with her as much as I would have liked and I do have to take that into account that she is more nervous than most anyway....
No, actually, it's not rubbish, Marie. For one thing, we take them out of their nest way before it happens in the wild. I only have experience with cockatiels, lovebirds and budgies because these are the only species that, at one time or another, have had eggcidents in the birdroom and the babies stayed inside the nest until they were three months old while breeders wean and sell them way before they are this old. Then, when they first come out, they don't really go anywhere, they come out of the cavity but stay perched or take very short practice flights and always come back to the nest area (they are still been fed by the parents and they don't really leave their side unless the parents go out to get food when the babies stay behind). But even adults don't really venture anywhere by themselves. In nature, you never see a parrot on its own, there are always at least two of them and, if you pay attention, you see and hear the rest of the flock. And it's a known fact that they don't go outside their territory, something that worries environmentalists, ornithologists and biologists, because not having the capacity to 'explore' new places, they die when their territory can no longer support them and that's why they calculate that almost all tropical and semi-tropical bird species will become extinct with global warming.
When we talk about socializing a little baby bird, people usually mean exposing the baby or juvenile to strange places and people so as to 'get him used' to it - but this never, ever, ever happens in nature.
As to their needing socialization not to be scared of new toys, new cages, etc, I don't agree. My birds never go out and hardly ever see anybody but me but I can move things around, take cages out, put cages in, even move from one house to another (7 times in the 20+ years I've been keeping parrots) and they don't even blink so it's not early socialization that does it.